Bandwidth?

iniquitus · #1 04-26-2002, 12:49 PM

Quick Question:

Voice Chat? 3D Graphics? How much bandwidth will all these new features require? I'm guessing there are still alot of subscribers using 56K Dial-Up to connect to the ineternet... And they're always lagged. It's cool, but is it practical? Will you be able to turn off these new features?

AlkarenHyralt · #2 04-26-2002, 12:50 PM

The fallen one still has dial-up.

iniquitus · #3 04-26-2002, 12:53 PM

Perhaps I should just trust that Stefan alredy considered this, he's usualy good about this sort of thing.

Kaimetsu · #4 04-26-2002, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by iniquitus
Quick Question:

Voice Chat? 3D Graphics? How much bandwidth will all these new features require? I'm guessing there are still alot of subscribers using 56K Dial-Up to connect to the ineternet... And they're always lagged. It's cool, but is it practical? Will you be able to turn off these new features?

Why would 3D graphics require more bandwidth?

ZanderX · #5 04-26-2002, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kaimetsu

Why would 3D graphics require more bandwidth?

*snicker*

Saga2001 · #6 04-26-2002, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by AlkarenHyralt
The fallen one still has dial-up.

...and so does PastAustin.

Quote:

Originally posted by Kaimetsu
Why would 3D graphics require more bandwidth?

Kauz thay r all grafxie and that stfu 1sn't locole to ure komputa or ne than.

Graal518 · #7 04-26-2002, 03:35 PM

The insane one will always have dialup, sadly.

toad1413 · #8 04-26-2002, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Graal518
The insane one will always have dialup, sadly.

But I'm the insane fool... you... you stole my title...

Spanko · #9 04-26-2002, 04:22 PM

It's also weighed off by the fact that since you have to upgrade for those features, you'll also just partly pay for the bandwidth costs.

As for the 3d terrain thing, it only needs to send information once.

Graal518 · #10 04-26-2002, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by toad1413

But I'm the insane fool... you... you stole my title...

Damn. I'm sorry.

I'll buy the title from you. Or pay royalties.

Admins · #11 04-26-2002, 04:47 PM

The 3d terrain is calculated at runtime, actually the level data will be less because there is less tiling in the levels (just paths and stuff).
The voice chat will work by udp. The standard compression is GSM which takes 13 kbit for each person you speak with, but it will be reduced to LPC10 or so when there are more people, which then makes 2.4 kbit for each person, meaning with a 56kbit modem you can talk in full duplex with ~10 people (10*2*2.4). If it's a problem then you turn off your micro in the Graal options and set the voice volume to 0, then you will not get voice data from other people.

Graal518 · #12 04-26-2002, 04:50 PM

It will be interesting to see Graal with all these new options. I can't wait.

toad1413 · #13 04-26-2002, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Graal518

Damn. I'm sorry. I'll buy the title from you. Or pay royalties.

Well, I don't really use it that much, I usually use fool more. So yeah. I'll lease it to you for a while.

Graal518 · #14 04-26-2002, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by toad1413

Well, I don't really use it that much, I usually use fool more. So yeah. I'll lease it to you for a while.

Much <3 for you, Toad.

toad1413 · #15 04-26-2002, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Graal518
Much <3 for you, Toad.

How can I contact you to work out the leasing details?

Graal518 · #16 04-26-2002, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by toad1413

How can I contact you to work out the leasing details?

I'll have my people draw up a legally binding contract. Then we can get in touch.

omni-m00gle · #17 04-26-2002, 05:35 PM

the voice chat will be fun.

craig_bomy · #18 04-26-2002, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Graal518

I'll have my people draw up a legally binding contract. Then we can get in touch.

Cyn, i did one:

Quote:

If Cyn uses toad title, it would be advisible for toad not to argue, for the soul reason that Cyn is bigger than toad and would pound him.

Now sign on the dotted line

toad1413 · #19 04-26-2002, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Graal518

I'll have my people draw up a legally binding contract. Then we can get in touch.

Hmm... ok. But before anything is finallized, I want my people to look over it too.

Graal518 · #20 04-26-2002, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by craig_bomy
Cyn, i did one:

Now sign on the dotted line

Haha. Simple, and yet straight to the point.

But still, Cyn can't underestimate Toad because of size...Because maybe Toad is really like The Incredible Hulk and changes when he is angry. Then Cyn would be in trouble. Because he would be dead.

toad1413 · #21 04-26-2002, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by craig_bomy
Cyn, i did one:

Quote:

If Cyn uses toad title, it would be advisible for toad not to argue, for the soul reason that Cyn is bigger than toad and would pound him.

Now sign on the dotted line

No. That will not do, I do not like to be pounded.

toad1413 · #22 04-26-2002, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Graal518

Haha. Simple, and yet straight to the point. But still, Cyn can't underestimate Toad because of size...Because maybe Toad is really like The Incredible Hulk and changes when he is angry. Then Cyn would be in trouble. Because he would be dead.

Nah. toad just goes insane when annoyed. Nothing to worry about.

Graal518 · #23 04-26-2002, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by toad1413

Nah. toad just goes insane when annoyed. Nothing to worry about.

But I go insane a lot..

What would happen if we were insane at the same time?

craig_bomy · #24 04-26-2002, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Graal518

But I go insane a lot.. What would happen if we were insane at the same time?

how about I perform an experiment where i give you two half of each others brains, so when you are insane you both can be simultaniusly (sp).

Graal518 · #25 04-26-2002, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by craig_bomy
how about I perform an experiment where i give you two half of each others brains, so when you are insane you both can be simultaniusly (sp).

The thought of the combined insanity of Toad and myself sounds dangerous. Are you trained to handle this kind of thing, Craig?

LilNiglet · #26 04-26-2002, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Stefan
The 3d terrain is calculated at runtime, actually the level data will be less because there is less tiling in the levels (just paths and stuff).
The voice chat will work by udp. The standard compression is GSM which takes 13 kbit for each person you speak with, but it will be reduced to LPC10 or so when there are more people, which then makes 2.4 kbit for each person, meaning with a 56kbit modem you can talk in full duplex with ~10 people (10*2*2.4). If it's a problem then you turn off your micro in the Graal options and set the voice volume to 0, then you will not get voice data from other people.

stefn u r soe smert

toad1413 · #27 04-26-2002, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Graal518

But I go insane a lot.. What would happen if we were insane at the same time?

Well, it'd be dangerous. Not to us though, but to other people, maybe. Too much insanity can have drastic effects. >:]

iniquitus · #28 04-26-2002, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Stefan
The 3d terrain is calculated at runtime, actually the level data will be less because there is less tiling in the levels (just paths and stuff).
The voice chat will work by udp. The standard compression is GSM which takes 13 kbit for each person you speak with, but it will be reduced to LPC10 or so when there are more people, which then makes 2.4 kbit for each person, meaning with a 56kbit modem you can talk in full duplex with ~10 people (10*2*2.4). If it's a problem then you turn off your micro in the Graal options and set the voice volume to 0, then you will not get voice data from other people.

WOW, I didn't know you could stream Audible Audio with that little bandwidth! Very nice Stefan!

toad1413 · #29 04-26-2002, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Graal518

The thought of the combined insanity of Toad and myself sounds dangerous. Are you trained to handle this kind of thing, Craig?

You're right, it could have very bad consequences. Although, it could also be quite fun.

Shorty2Dope · #30 04-26-2002, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by toad1413

But I'm the insane fool... you... you stole my title...

Bah I have been the insane fool longer than you all! You stole my title!
(My online me has always been insane, as alk has always been the fallen angel)

toad1413 · #31 04-26-2002, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Shorty2Dope

Bah I have been the insane fool longer than you all! You stole my title!
(My online me has always been insane, as alk has always been the fallen angel)

Bah. I've been insane all my life. I was BORN insane.

Therefore... I AM... THE INSANE FOOL!@! HEAHAEHEAHAEHEA!

ahem.

Shorty2Dope · #32 04-26-2002, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by toad1413

Bah. I've been insane all my life. I was BORN insane.

Therefore... I AM... THE INSANE FOOL!@! HEAHAEHEAHAEHEA!

ahem.

No! I was admited to the insane asylum a few years ago, so blah!

Graal518 · #33 04-26-2002, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by toad1413

You're right, it could have very bad consequences. Although, it could also be quite fun.

Yes. It would be indeed a new fun venture. Muwahaha. As for you, Shorty, I am insane, too. So is Toad. It can't be stopped. Muwahaha!

Admins · #34 04-27-2002, 12:35 AM

It's interesting to test this voice stuff. There are voice codecs that only take 225 bytes each second but provide good quality

Kaimetsu · #35 04-27-2002, 12:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Stefan
It's interesting to test this voice stuff. There are voice codecs that only take 225 bytes each second but provide good quality

Egads, modern compression rates are amazing

DarkDragon452 · #36 04-27-2002, 01:06 AM

This topic has turned into spam about insanity titles... How? dunno. x.x

I personally can't wait for voice chat. Though I myself will just listen.... not say much =P

iniquitus · #37 04-27-2002, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Stefan
It's interesting to test this voice stuff. There are voice codecs that only take 225 bytes each second but provide good quality

Thats awesome! It'll be interesting to see how it takes off though... might get confusing in crowed areas as to who is speaking, or alot of players might have mic's connected. I always think it's nice when you can eaisly minimise a game, or turn off the sound without missing out, so you can hide it from your boss! hehe. (I don't need to do that though.)

Stefan:

A few quick questions:

Are you the only programer, still or are there more people helping out with Graal? I'll be going to school for CS in the fall, and I'd love to help out with Graal over the next few years.

How do you feel about the GNU GPL?