Updates?

[Spiker]

I have heard there are about 2 or 3 new things coming to graal, which are the weather system ((If it is even still going on)) and the flying system. Does ANYBODY know when it is going to be released, if there a special day they have made for it, what? I am getting really pissed off at graal because the people who said they will update it with new updates dont, and that makes me think graal is a peice of crap, because of the lies put out.

[lordbosh]

I hear even the top staff have given up on GK. Like the owners. But I cannot confirm nor deny that rumor.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by lordbosh

But I cannot confirm nor deny that rumor.

I can, it's false.

[Spiker]

Well then what is stefan, unixmad, sam, and bjorn doing for graal. Because it seems not alot to me

[protozero]

Originally Posted by Spiker

I have heard there are about 2 or 3 new things coming to graal, which are the weather system ((If it is even still going on)) and the flying system. Does ANYBODY know when it is going to be released, if there a special day they have made for it, what? I am getting really pissed off at graal because the people who said they will update it with new updates dont, and that makes me think graal is a peice of crap, because of the lies put out.

I know what you mean. Like...Malinko like 6 months ago said that Weather should be released really soon and that he had finished it. It's pretty dissapointing and un-professional.

[Spiker]

Yeah, really. Even DEO said he was working on it, now I think I got a bad name for deo a bit

[myth-simba]

Pardon my french, but they are twats. Not all of them but a large proportion due to the lazyness. And they have the nerve to deny new members to join when they so desperately need them.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by myth-simba

Pardon my french, but they are twats. Not all of them but a large proportion due to the lazyness. And they have the nerve to deny new members to join when they so desperately need them.

There's a real information gap here.

Sam isn't a developer - sure he can make some ideas, but he needs scripters, gani artists, graphics artists, and sound artists to make projects. So you really need to sit down and just stop insulting Sam.

Bjorn? He's let go some of his PWA duties so he can develop more for GK. Didn't hear about that? That's because you really aren't in the loop, and shouldn't try to act like you are. Know why? You're just spouting your mouth off.

Alright, so Malinko's idea hasn't been released yet. There's a good reason - it's because he's either quit or disappeared. Anyways, it's not entirely finished yet. Can't just slap something that isn't finish in there - we're not talking shoes, or something here - if the scripts aren't finished properly they could really screw stuff up. You'd rather no pretty weather than a non-functional Gk, wouldn't you?

The biggest problem so far is a lack of scripters. Now you're probably thinking "I can script!" but, more than likely, you really cannot script to the level which is necessary to be a member of the Graal Kingdoms scripting team. This is really serious stuff. Another problem is a lack of graphic artists. I do some stuff now and then, but I have school and other things to concentrate so I can't do it all, and I'm not the only one. There are other graphics artists, but without scripters what good are some new graphics?

That's pretty much it. It's pretty frustrating to have users, Spiker, saying "Oh those bastards don't know anything, and they suck, and this, and that". I'm not them, and I'm not their best friend - but it really irritates me to see someone so utterly uninformed drawing conclusions from what would appear to be thin air.

This is an unofficial response. I am a member of the Debug Development Team. However, other members of the team might disagree with some points I've made so take them only as opinionated assessment of the current development issues and not as fact.

[Ravenblade1979]

Sam can now upload levels thanks to me..or didn't you know that?

[MasterNuke]

It's still taking a really long time.

[lordbosh]

Maybe players should be let in that 'loop' a bit more often. Id like to see some real Professional working happening. And maybe some actual announcements that have credibility. 'it will happen soon' is retarded, because it does not state a deadline. Without a deadline people will put it off until it never happens.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

Sam can now upload levels thanks to me..or didn't you know that?

Right, I'm sure the exceedingly huge population of GK will enjoy all of the levels he can upload that lack both graphics, and scripts... unless they're developed by people on Debug.

Think > Post

Originally Posted by lordbosh

Maybe players should be let in that 'loop' a bit more often. Id like to see some real Professional working happening. And maybe some actual announcements that have credibility. 'it will happen soon' is retarded, because it does not state a deadline. Without a deadline people will put it off until it never happens.

Uhg, believe me - I agree. Although most of the stuff being developed now is "top secret", and some other stuff I probably shouldn't discuss.

[Waltz5]

My biggest problem... staff/owners should not let it get to the point where almost everyone bashs their lack of updates/notices.

If I run something and notice a good deal of people complaining, I'm going to certainly appease them by communicating and then doing my best to do what is feasible yet still within my plans.

There's no sign of this at all with Graal.


As for your lack of staff answer, it's an easy way out. There were plenty of able people who helped with GK in it's hay-day. But now who would want to work for it when they don't see even a minimal effort? And if it's behind the scenes secret development it shouldn't be for many reasons... this being one.

[jonnyrocks2]

Honestly, the staff need to be more open regarding there "OMG SUPER SEKRET" stuff.

Being open often encourages the players to slap out their own good two cents, rather then spamming that it "SUX" or "BLOWS ***."

Honestly, somethings needing to be done sooner or later before the player count drops to zero, but I'm just not seeing it anytime soon.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

Sam can now upload levels thanks to me..or didn't you know that?

Thanks Raven for adding me upload rights .

Stephens post explaint it very good and beside this Stefan has made his comments about this theme in other threads before, I don't see any reason for going around in a circuit and explain it again and again.

[dNeonb]

Originally Posted by Stephen

Bjorn? He's let go some of his PWA duties so he can develop more for GK.

Not only some. I completely quit PWA.

[Magadal]

Originally Posted by dNeonb

Not only some. I completely quit PWA.

And you still dont have much time for GK. I think a manager should have enough time for a 'project' like GK :/

[dNeonb]

Originally Posted by Magadal

And you still dont have much time for GK. I think a manager should have enough time for a 'project' like GK :/

Stefan is manager, not me.

[Waltz5]

Originally Posted by Sam

Stephens post explaint it very good and beside this Stefan has made his comments about this theme in other threads before, I don't see any reason for going around in a circuit and explain it again and again.

Maybe because the answers are extremely insufficient and your players aren't happy?

[Magadal]

Originally Posted by dNeonb

Stefan is manager, not me.

I was told you are manager several times.

[Spiker]

Originally Posted by Stephen

That's pretty much it. It's pretty frustrating to have users, Spiker, saying "Oh those bastards don't know anything, and they suck, and this, and that".

I would really appreciate it if you didnt ruin my reputaion by saying I called you guys Bastards and such. I never said anything to the such. Also, I was just asking about update times and some info. You are making this conclusion apon myth-simba's post. Please dont do that. Also, couldnt somebody just answer my question rather than saying thanks for upload folders and such. All I asked for was an answer. Thanks

-Spiker

[alarid0]

Originally Posted by Stephen

This is really serious stuff. Another problem is a lack of graphic artists. I do some stuff now and then, but I have school and other things to concentrate so I can't do it all, and I'm not the only one. There are other graphics artists, but without scripters what good are some new graphics?

Woo but I'm on the case now And as of late I've finally been able to get serious with my GK effort. I've got a lot to do, and I don't intend on breaking my promises I swear on...hrm...on my mouse

Though, as it's been pointed out...

Originally Posted by Galdor

... everyone knows alarid cant script

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by Waltz5

Maybe because the answers are extremely insufficient and your players aren't happy?

Are you saying the fairly lengthy post I created as an explanation doesn't tell you why development has been slow? It should.

Originally Posted by Magadal

I was told you are manager several times.

Well, you just heard it directly from Bjorn - he's not manager.

Originally Posted by Spiker

I would really appreciate it if you didnt ruin my reputaion by saying I called you guys Bastards and such.

Sorry, I meant "twits". Here you go buddy, you can keep the whole box. You seem like you'll need it.



-Stephen

[Spiker]

Yeah, sorry, but that was also off of myth-simba's post. Please check your Sources before you post

[MasterNuke]

He's just hungry.
Edit: ... for some updates.

[Spiker]

who me or Stephan, I am acually trying to help...and flames i get

[Draenin]

Originally Posted by Spiker

who me or Stephan, I am acually trying to help...and flames i get

Sometimes you have to be ready for the truth.

[Ravenblade1979]

Bjorn your GK Administration. Everyone knows that.

[ViperZakuto]

Originally Posted by Stephen

The biggest problem so far is a lack of scripters. Now you're probably thinking "I can script!" but, more than likely, you really cannot script to the level which is necessary to be a member of the Graal Kingdoms scripting team. This is really serious stuff. Another problem is a lack of graphic artists. I do some stuff now and then, but I have school and other things to concentrate so I can't do it all, and I'm not the only one. There are other graphics artists, but without scripters what good are some new graphics?

Well there is one problem that has been discussed before... All the admins are German or somewhere close to germany, while i would say 80% of the population on gk is American. I have met many Americans that can script very well infact. Also people from austrailia and other countries that are not close to germany. They would talk to bjorn and bjorn wouldn't even respond or ignore them because he couldn't understand them. Bjorn does not do english very well. You talk to him in english and he takes what you said and interprets it totally backwards most of the time (intentionally or unintentionally, I don't know). We need a PWA that is bilingual(or however you spell it). Someone that can understand most people.

Back when i started graal somewhere around 98-99. Classic was the gold server and GK or Bomy moon never existed. I played a free server called dino valley. It had a lot of potential. 50+ people a day(that was good back then). Then Jagen came and some other german people took it over and that was the end of that server.

My point is stop hiring people that can't understand 80-90% of the playercount. That is why a lot of people quit.

[cyan3]

Originally Posted by ViperZakuto

You talk to him in english and he takes what you said and interprets it totally backwards most of the time

The last time i talked to Bjorn about something he said what i just said just dont in the same way.

[zokemon]

Originally Posted by Stephen

The biggest problem so far is a lack of scripters. Now you're probably thinking "I can script!" but, more than likely, you really cannot script to the level which is necessary to be a member of the Graal Kingdoms scripting team. This is really serious stuff. Another problem is a lack of graphic artists. I do some stuff now and then, but I have school and other things to concentrate so I can't do it all, and I'm not the only one. There are other graphics artists, but without scripters what good are some new graphics?

Or maybe the higher ups don't want to look at the talent in front of them?
Anyone can log onto Maloria Dev, see the work that I do and know my skill is at or even above GKs. I don't want to gloat though; Relic has a very good scripter too and I have seen quite a number of private servers with exceptional scripters. Stefan and Bjorn just don't look for the talent even when it is right infront of them (or they are to busy...? I have no idea).

[Ravenblade1979]

Originally Posted by zokemon

Or maybe the higher ups don't want to look at the talent in front of them?
Anyone can log onto Maloria Dev, see the work that I do and know my skill is at or even above GKs. I don't want to gloat though; Relic has a very good scripter too and I have seen quite a number of private servers with exceptional scripters. Stefan and Bjorn just don't look for the talent even when it is right infront of them (or they are to busy...? I have no idea).

Well Bjorn just don't trust anyone else and Stefan is way too busy to care. It took me a month just to get Sam on as a level uploader.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

Well Bjorn just don't trust anyone else and Stefan is way too busy to care. It took me a month just to get Sam on as a level uploader.

I dont know who told you, Stefan gave me upload right on your request.

Originally Posted by ViperZakuto

Well there is one problem that has been discussed before... All the admins are German or somewhere close to germany, while i would say 80% of the population on gk is American. I have met many Americans that can script very well infact. Also people from austrailia and other countries that are not close to germany. They would talk to bjorn and bjorn wouldn't even respond or ignore them because he couldn't understand them. Bjorn does not do english very well. You talk to him in english and he takes what you said and interprets it totally backwards most of the time (intentionally or unintentionally, I don't know). We need a PWA that is bilingual(or however you spell it). Someone that can understand most people.

Back when i started graal somewhere around 98-99. Classic was the gold server and GK or Bomy moon never existed. I played a free server called dino valley. It had a lot of potential. 50+ people a day(that was good back then). Then Jagen came and some other german people took it over and that was the end of that server.

My point is stop hiring people that can't understand 80-90% of the playercount. That is why a lot of people quit.

To make conjectures who, how much and what "the germans or people somewhere close to germany" understand or not are hogwash.
1. Somewhere close to germany people are talking a lot of different languages. But in almost every country people are also talking english (in contrast to the majority of US citizens).
2. This game was scripted by german scripter.
3. Because of corrupt staff in the past the management decided not take more care about the current and further staff, so if the staff is unknown or not good enough to do an excellent developing job, they have no chance to become a scripter or developer for GK.
4. A developer don't need to talk to the players, but to script what the managemnet want him to do.

5. Jagen was staff from US and corrupt as hell, and we (the staff from germany and somewhere close to it) convict him and getting him globally banned.
6. PWA's are for playerworlds not for Gold Servers, but you are maybe right, the current PWA's are from USA and so far I know they do not speak germany or french, not sure about other languages. Maybe Unixmad and Stefan should hire some new PWA's from Europe.

7. People quit because of many different reasons and there are also almost every day new players coming, maybe they are playing in diff. timezone so you dont see them.

Fact is: we are willing to hire staff, but we have precise conception what we want and what we dont want and until today we didnt find such a person.

PS.: I hope you can understand my bad english, if not I'm very sorrowful.

[Draenin]

Originally Posted by Sam

3. Because of corrupt staff in the past the management decided not take more care about the current and further staff, so if the staff is unknown or not good enough to do an excellent developing job, they have no chance to become a scripter or developer for GK.

Yeah, but they did the job better. They didn't let castles vanish and claim that levelling bugs were legal, all the while keeping them from Stefan. It was bad enough that I had to be the one to tell Stefan, considering that it once again made things harder on the players. Don't talk badly about past administrators you didn't know when you yourself really aren't that different.

Originally Posted by Sam

5. Jagen was staff from US and corrupt as hell, and we (the staff from germany and somewhere close to it) convict him and getting him globally banned.

And it took you guys how many years to do this? Three? Four?

Originally Posted by Sam

7. People quit because of many different reasons and there are also almost every day new players coming, maybe they are playing in diff. timezone so you dont see them.

It's old, Sam. Times like these we don't need that sort of logic, and you know it.

Originally Posted by Sam

Fact is: we are willing to hire staff, but we have precise conception what we want and what we dont want and until today we didnt find such a person.

Yeah, but people complaining about the German players in this game is just as bad as German players and admins being full of mistrust toward U.S. players just because some have messed up in the past by doing stuff they shouldn't. While you've the right to talk about Jagen's expulsion from the game due to it being common knowledge, you haven't the right to neglect mentioning other English-native staff members that have done a great job like Spark and Lance.



I knew all along that this is what it all boils down to, and it's thoroughly satisfying to have someone repeat your exact thoughts to you without a bit of mention. I knew that this is the reason why Stefan has been watching Kingdoms fairly closely for the past few years, and it's pretty ugly when you think about it. It's just really too bad that he doesn't exactly have the option to have the same sort of interaction that Kingdoms current management does. This is why all the torches are going out one by one, and if it continues, I'm not going to choke back laughter and pretend I didn't tell you so.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Draenin

Yeah, but they did the job better. They didn't let castles vanish and claim that levelling bugs were legal, all the while keeping them from Stefan. It was bad enough that I had to be the one to tell Stefan, considering that it once again made things harder on the players. Don't talk badly about past administrators you didn't know when you yourself really aren't that different.

I didnt play GK when Spark (living in Europe btw) was Admin for GK. Lance told me here on forums that the leveling bug IS a bug and needs to be fixed, but he didnt do anything to fix it!
At this time I was EM.
Before this day I didn't know that its a bug (because I dont know about scripting). I investigated later and came to the conclusion that it should be fixed asap and asked Stefan to do it.

Originally Posted by Draenin

And it took you guys how many years to do this? Three? Four?

Yann and me did it in team work after we got the rights and abilities to check such things.

Originally Posted by Draenin

It's old, Sam. Times like these we don't need that sort of logic, and you know it.
Yeah, but people complaining about the German players in this game is just as bad as German players and admins being mistru****l of U.S. players just because some have messed up in the past by doing stuff they shouldn't. While you've the right to talk about Jagen's expulsion from the game, you haven't the right to neglect mentioning other English-native staff members that have done a great job like Spark and Lance.

Think first before attacking someone, I didn't talk about staff from diff. countries, all I did was replying to Viper Zakuto and I am sick to read such crap again and again.

[WanDaMan]

Originally Posted by Sam

4. A developer don't need to talk to the players, but to script what the managemnet want him to do.

Management need to play the game though; updates what the players want are always better than updates created by the Management.

[Draenin]

Originally Posted by Sam

I didnt play GK when Spark (living in Europe btw) was Admin for GK. Lance told me here on forums that the leveling bug IS a bug and needs to be fixed, but he didnt do anything to fix it!

By that time, it wasn't his job. He found the error when he was GST, reported it, and that little fact died there, for some reason. Also, I wasn't talking about Spark until the last sentence of my post. I was referring to the co-management of Jagen and Lance. And much as you like to prattle on about Jagen like everyone else does, he did do his job, and he did it well. The only difference is that he did it too well.

Originally Posted by Sam

Before this day I didn't know that its a bug (because I dont know about scripting). I investigated later and came to the conclusion that it should be fixed asap and asked Stefan to do it.

Of course you didn't. Something just feels right about surpassing the cumulative years of work people have put into their levels in a week's time, doesn't it?

Originally Posted by Sam

Yann and me did it in team work after we got the rights and abilities to check such things.

Everyone and their mother knew about it. And even if you couldn't do anything about it, you surely were capable of reporting it to someone who could.

Originally Posted by Sam

Think first before attacking someone

There's quite a bit of difference between attacking and being assertive, Sam.

Originally Posted by WanDaMan

Management need to play the game though; updates what the players want are always better than updates created by the Management.

Well put.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Draenin

By that time, it wasn't his job. He found the error when he was GST, reported it, and that little fact died there, for some reason. Also, I wasn't talking about Spark until the last section. I was referring to the co-management of Jagen and Lance, who trusted the wrong person to take care of the server past then.

trusted the wrong person and didn't takes care the whole time until he quit the job. He had the rights and abilities to check Jagen after Jagen was kicked, but he didn't, I will not assume the reason why.

Originally Posted by Draenin

Of course you didn't. Something just feels right about surpassing the cumulative years of work people have put into their levels in a week's time, doesn't it?

It not my job as PLAYER to try to get to the bottom of the scripts or leveling mechanics, as I said I wasn't in the staff postition to judge such things as EM. Or could you do that while you was EM. Even as GP you wasn't able.

Originally Posted by Draenin

Everyone and their mother knew about it. And even if you couldn't do anything about it, you surely were capable of reporting it to someone who could.

What happend.

[Draenin]

Originally Posted by Sam

It not my job as PLAYER to try to get to the bottom of the scripts or leveling mechanics, as I said I wasn't in the staff postition to judge such things as EM. Or could you do that while you was EM. Even as GP you wasn't able.

I didn't say it was your job. Lance reported it on the forums. At the time, it was his job to check the scripts, not yours, and he did and reported them. Why it wasn't taken care of there and then is beyond me. Why Bjorn didn't do a lot of things is beyond me, as a matter of fact. It really makes me wonder just how long a blind eye is going to be turned to a community that's diminishing. Maybe Cyberjoueurs doesn't care anymore. Or maybe they care too much.

It seems to me that Cyberjoueurs has grown to care too much about being right than they have being human. I miss being able to rely on some people to listen sometimes.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Draenin

I didn't say it was your job. Lance reported it on the forums. At the time, it was his job to check the scripts, not yours, and he did and reported them. Why it wasn't taken care of there and then is beyond me. Why Bjorn didn't do a lot of things is beyond me, as a matter of fact. It really makes me wonder just how long a blind eye is going to be turned to a community that's diminishing. Maybe Cyberjoueurs doesn't care anymore. Or maybe they care too much.

Once bitten, twice shy. I think Stefan don't give rights so quick as it was done before the "Jagen era". If I'm right Björn got mud access 2 month ago or so and still not the full access.
The management set their priorities and so they are working on this first and foremost.