The New Gold Server: Ideas to help Graal

Tyhm · #1 10-12-2006, 12:28 AM

My ideas are getting buried in the Lifetime Classic thread, so I'll start a few new ones.

The New Gold Server
Purpose: to bring in money from new clients based on a hot new game
Options: I can make a server - I have two or three notebooks full of ideas on a fully-custom distributed-gani character system, make it a postmodern platform RPG with a dynamic play-area and player-submitted quests for a constantly enriching environment...but I imagine everyone who suggested it is of a like mind, They've got a server that could go gold if only Stefan helped Them...
Expansion: Maybe the problem isn't so much that we should make A Gold Server, so much that Everyone should have the level of support that only Stefan can (currently) give - maybe if he were given a reprieve from fixing symptoms he could build tools that let us fix things ourselves.
Requires: The undivided attention of Stefan, no matter who's making this new cool server.

Alright, we've got Kingdoms, a medieval MMORPG Money-Heavy Server, and we've got Zone, the ONO LOOK OUT IT'S A RAY GUN server. Two genres out of a nigh-infinite variety. Sure, there should be more - why aren't there? Is it that PW owners aren't willing to make their servers go gold? Is it that it's too hard to make a server that good without Stefan tweaking the engine Just For You? Is the bar set too high for ordinary mortals to meet between classes and working our minimum-wage jobs?

Seriously, I don't know. Hey, some of you guys have worlds...?

dude2020 · #2 10-13-2006, 02:22 AM

Gold Servers were made by Global staff (besides zone becuase the oringal staff quit) and Graal 3D summer is close to finish i think x.x

coreys · #3 10-13-2006, 02:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude2020

Gold Servers were made by Global staff (besides zone becuase the oringal staff quit) and Graal 3D summer is close to finish i think x.x

Well, globals took over Zone after that though, so it was partially made by globals, I beleive.

dude2020 · #4 10-13-2006, 02:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coreys

Well, globals took over Zone after that though, so it was partially made by globals, I beleive.

the Globals kept it pretty good until like sometime ago they dicided to focus on different things adn the gold servers are slowly diein

Tyhm · #5 10-13-2006, 05:51 AM

Should Graal3D be the new Gold server then? Or should another one be made? Are there enough global admins not working on G3D to do it? Should a popular Classic PW be Promoted to Gold? What would serve as appropriate compensation for the PW's owner and his alienated players?

smirt362 · #6 10-13-2006, 06:50 AM

I thought they were planning to create some sort of mission system on Zone? Where you could sneak arround accomplishing targets or blast your way through.

I would be interested enough in that (if it was executed nicely) to upgrade for something of that nature.

dude2020 · #7 10-13-2006, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyhm

Should Graal3D be the new Gold server then? Or should another one be made? Are there enough global admins not working on G3D to do it? Should a popular Classic PW be Promoted to Gold? What would serve as appropriate compensation for the PW's owner and his alienated players?

Graal 3D is infact the new Gold Sever (see stefans pic XD)

Quote:

Originally Posted by smirt362

I thought they were planning to create some sort of mission system on Zone? Where you could sneak arround accomplishing targets or blast your way through.

I would be interested enough in that (if it was executed nicely) to upgrade for something of that nature.

they are its been 4 years senice it was planed so it must be close of being done and they might be working on a Speeder planet on the Sun

jacob_bald6225 · #8 10-13-2006, 09:05 PM

If there was a new gold server I think Classic accounts should be able to free-play it for 20 hours of online time. Once you hit 20 hours, it should save your stats for when you upgrade, and start treating you as a trial.

Admins · #9 10-13-2006, 10:14 PM

We are working on a new guest account thingy.

Zone was 100% scripted by me (plus some help from Loriel for the vehicle code and Kaimetsu for the vehicle particles), also the characters are completely new and are using gold graphics. The server that is closest to that is Era where we have helped last year for the release.

Graal3D will be Gold yes. Also there is a Jump'n'Run project in the planning, contact Tom for more. For Graal Kingdoms we plan to finish the flying things (balloon-fights), and also plan other updates like new quests and kingdom wars. For Zone it is planned to add missions and new maps.

WarLord2004 · #10 10-14-2006, 01:45 AM

Ok let me get this straight. Your turning zone into Mission Impossible and Kingdoms into some morden days with anew? In other words reason i think i use to dislike Graal Kingdoms it hasn't stayed on one issue. Reasons why am a fanactic of roleplay, i like to see warp poratl or spells not traveling by an Air Ballon. Kingdoms do have one of the greatest system for roleplaying but there is basically none. I wish graal has a system base on it's name for servers i hate how the modern world mixes with the current world. Soon we shall have cars on kingdoms? There should be more futher development on kingdoms as such as mystical new islands go beyound with high level players who can visit sacred shrines to get to monsters (high level) and drop special rare items (but monster only spawns when you do ceratin quest. Like spawn a dragon or some what. ... anyways let me get a grip i don't own Graal :-p

jake13jake · #11 10-14-2006, 06:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarLord2004

Ok let me get this straight. Your turning zone into Mission Impossible and Kingdoms into some morden days with anew? In other words reason i think i use to dislike Graal Kingdoms it hasn't stayed on one issue. Reasons why am a fanactic of roleplay, i like to see warp poratl or spells not traveling by an Air Ballon. Kingdoms do have one of the greatest system for roleplaying but there is basically none. I wish graal has a system base on it's name for servers i hate how the modern world mixes with the current world. Soon we shall have cars on kingdoms? There should be more futher development on kingdoms as such as mystical new islands go beyound with high level players who can visit sacred shrines to get to monsters (high level) and drop special rare items (but monster only spawns when you do ceratin quest. Like spawn a dragon or some what. ... anyways let me get a grip i don't own Graal :-p

Mostly I don't like Kingdoms or Zone because of the controls. I also hate the terrain.

Tyhm · #12 10-14-2006, 09:41 PM

*shrugs* If Stefan says he has enough gold servers, that's good enough for me.

Devil · #13 10-15-2006, 04:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyhm

*shrugs* If Stefan says he has enough gold servers, that's good enough for me.

Um what?

What about the rest of the players who are saying it's not enough to upgrade to gold to play 2 servers that doesn't interest even 1/3 of Graal's playerbase?

irule13 · #14 10-15-2006, 05:18 AM

There is a gun and a rpg type gold server, maybe have a classic style one also with the old systems like classic sword and shield and leveling up your sword and shield, plus hearts and stuff.

smirt362 · #15 10-15-2006, 05:25 AM

I'm thinking a classic kind of server...but in platformer form. That would be pretty cool.

irule13 · #16 10-15-2006, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smirt362

I'm thinking a classic kind of server...but in platformer form. That would be pretty cool.

And with a variety of fun items, trial status for non gold members like the other gold servers, it could be pretty fun.

Tyhm · #17 10-15-2006, 05:38 AM

*shrugs* I got the notes to make one a those, but once Stefan says Kingdoms+Zone+G3D=All the Gold there's gonna be, there's really no countermanding that. Besides, I'd be hard pressed to make any sort of platformer at all without Stefan's help; there's bound to be a fi****ll of commands I'd need either made or fixed...things like Paralax, layering of images by something other than Bottom-Y....

irule13 · #18 10-15-2006, 05:46 AM

Well, its worth thinking about anyway.

Devil · #19 10-15-2006, 08:37 AM

A platformer certainly isn't going to help with the lack of things to do in regards to Gold servers.

Tyhm · #20 10-15-2006, 10:44 AM

Ahh, I see what you're getting at: Another Gold Server would just be spreading the little time-devoted-to-developing-content yet thinner. After all, if Stefan's making quests for Kingdoms and quests for Zone and a system for G3D and fixing bugs and skinning the client and RC and making a mac RC and a linux RC and coming out with a new version, asking him to make one more world means cutting back on the other two, at the very least...likewise any globals working on two would be working on three...

So: Should the best existing classic server go Gold? Should existing servers offer Gold content? If you could fly on all (or most) servers, would that make Gold more attractive? What needs to be in place to make any of these options possible - better tools so Classic servers can go Gold, better cooperation so we don't wind up with another buttload of worlds that never get out of Dev, ? I know when I left the dev environment was Too Many Scientists, Not Enough Hunchbacks; everyone wanted to make their own perfect world, everyone was clamouring for staff for their server, we had scads of servers with like 3 staffers (and when one left, it was abandoned). If Graal.net came back up and there was good reason for people to share information, that might help...I mean, imagine you could start your server with a serverside movement system, a custom inventory menu, default baddies, projectiles, throwing, push-pull blocks, etcetera, all scripted for you already...it'd save you those first few critical months, get your product publishable in a matter of weeks. Really you'd just have to take the Sample Level, copy and rearrange (and retile) into the dungeons you want...you could have hundreds of cookie-cutter worlds ready for the serverlist.
But then, how do you get 7 teenagers who all want to make 4-Swords Online Their Own Way to agree and work on the same server? I mean, in the short term getting 7 server fees is good for Graal, but in the long run it'd be better if they were all working on different parts of the same server...
Well, maybe that's where the Global Quest comes in. 7 servers, each has 1 quest, each has Global Strings set so you wind up with seven pieces of crystal in Hubworld, which you can unite to reopen the Dread Portal of Akhenaton and get to the Master's Quest on Classic...or something.

Tyhm · #21 10-27-2006, 04:00 AM

In response to Massokre:
*shrugs* That's the whole problem - you've got an idea for a server, I've got an idea for a server, and we all jealously guard our server-ideas because we don't want anyone beating us to the punch, stealing our thunder, out-marketing us on our "own" game.
Solution? I dunno, maybe Graal.net would make a good collaboration tool. Maybe people could register their Concepts there and, hopefully, share. For mine, it's using dynamically colored (but otherwise grayscale) ganis, using the new code to rotate an image, so you don't run into the old problem of "I want the graalian to wave, but it's not one of the 160 poses in the original body.png". Then, hopefully, using ganis-calling-ganis-as-sprites to have a relatively small number of main-ganis wielding a relatively large variety of weapons. Then, of course, I want to put it in a platformer RPG, because the gravity tower was just fun, even if the baddies only worked properly on my own computer. :-P

The trouble is - I can't do it alone. I've got the notes, the ideas, the commentary, etcetera, but I'm never gonna actually get around to it - there's always One More Feature I need; paralax, more drawing layers than just "Layer 1, sorted by bottom-y", etcetera. So, I'd be better off joining up with another group of people who are similarly working on Street-Fighter-2 quality ganis, sharing the results, joining up with another group of people working on a Platformer RPG, etc.

Well...I dunno, I haven't been to graal.net in aeons, CAN you declare joint ownership there? Would it be respected? Is it even possible to start up a Registered Concepts page? 'cuz I mean, I wouldn't mind working with some other people who have different views on the scenarios, on the setting, etc, but some things like management, linearity of quest timelines ("Have you killed Akhenaton yet?" is the sort of question that breaks immersion), the offline behavior of avatars, that sorta thing I can't budge on and still call it My Game. Selfish, probably, but we've got too many scientists and not enough hunchbacks, nobody wants to submit to anyone else's opinions.

jake13jake · #22 10-28-2006, 02:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyhm

In response to Massokre:
*shrugs* That's the whole problem - you've got an idea for a server, I've got an idea for a server, and we all jealously guard our server-ideas because we don't want anyone beating us to the punch, stealing our thunder, out-marketing us on our "own" game.

No, I'm not afraid of anyone stealing my thunder, I'm just looking for people I think would make a good dev team for it. The scripting would be the most difficult task, although I already have the tools I would need to make it. The perspective, however, would simplify level development a great deal. Graphics would be -extremely- unique. Unique in such a sense as that it would probably attract a LOT of art junkies.

Tyhm · #23 10-28-2006, 05:47 AM

And with such a unique set of graphics, you'll need a team - would you be willing to trade off getting a team with sharing the results? With the team? With Graal in general?
Maybe there needs to be a temporary "copyright" hold on projects developed on Graal.net - the contributors get to use it right away, the rest of Graal can use it a year later. Contributors decided by the majority of the team (starting with just the first handfull), copyright enforced by the Playerworld Admins...it's not like you can do that much with Graal's stuff off the Graal servers...:-P

Yen · #24 10-28-2006, 07:22 AM

The 'Jump'N'Run' (platform) server Stefan was talking about is dead, I think.

I've always wanted to make a ABG (active battle gauge) RPG style server, like Final Fantasy IV to X, with customizable parties and such. Each player would control their own party of up to 4 characters, which can be swapped at taverns or guilds or whatever to customize your team.
Unfortunately, the graphics just aren't there.

Tyhm · #25 10-28-2006, 07:43 AM

See? Get the graphics together as a team...I can do Some, just not enough. Get some good Gani guys in it. As for a party, I've had plans for that too...set up a system like Bomys or the old Black Graal, where the NPC exists on the server and follows you around, detects when you've logged off...then add a pinch of code for "And then it takes on your appearance and allegiances, so the healer isn't abandoned in the middle of the dungeon...they can control your avatar like an NPC until you get back from class, dinner, sleep, etc."

Everyone tells me the overhead would be impossible. I don't see it as any worse than Bomies.

Andy0687 · #26 10-28-2006, 09:59 AM

I have an ATB Server I was working on for a long time I had planned to offer up to stefan for gold tab.

I had a whole lot of work and time poured into it but in the end the PWA and Higher Administration just werent there to help me catch a break when i needed reviews and critique. Though I give props to VT for checking it out a few times for me back when, Calani, and Stefan even ran though it a few times.

The graphics werent the best but all the elements were there and pretty much done, had hoped to finish things up for a nice alpha test but we ran out of money for the server, such is life :P

Tyhm · #27 10-28-2006, 08:28 PM

Now, see, if graal.net had a Save Our Server section or something, where dying servers can graft together what they have, we'd be in good shape...unfortunately, how do you resolve the Owner of the west half of the map wants to use Classic style ganis whereas the Owner of the east half of the map wants to use custom Zone-esque ganis and delay release for as long as it takes to make them? Nobody's comfortable giving anyone else that much control over their work, even if it'd otherwise be sitting idle collecting dust...

If I ever get that hubworld, I tell you whut, one of the first things I'm gonna try and do is get a Default Server assembled and backed-up. Then I can petition the higher-ups to, when someone registers a server, instead of starting with a blank they start with my Default Backup, to delete and restart as they see fit. Maybe then people can branch off in more inventive ways, or at least start later in the development life cycle.

jake13jake · #28 10-29-2006, 01:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyhm

And with such a unique set of graphics, you'll need a team - would you be willing to trade off getting a team with sharing the results? With the team? With Graal in general?
Maybe there needs to be a temporary "copyright" hold on projects developed on Graal.net - the contributors get to use it right away, the rest of Graal can use it a year later. Contributors decided by the majority of the team (starting with just the first handfull), copyright enforced by the Playerworld Admins...it's not like you can do that much with Graal's stuff off the Graal servers...:-P

ganis, tiling, and scripting (aside from base scripts) wouldn't be such a big deal.

I mean, the overhead in scripting is enough for me to handle, and the graphics would become the fun part instead of the tedious part. The graphics wouldn't work on any other server in the first place, and I'd be more than willing to share the scripting.