Got a beef with Graal 3?

HoudiniMan · #1 02-08-2005, 12:59 AM

My only major beef with Graal 3 (that can't be re-scripted) is that you can't resize the window. There are a couple pre-set resolutions to pick from, but that seems like a downgrade in technology here.

Why was resizing taken out?

I'm hoping the display font is a scripted thing I can change...

Anybody else have any major problems with Graal 3?

TESTRETIS · #2 02-08-2005, 01:14 AM

You make a very good point Houdini. Only beef I really have with it is that it runs very slow on my mediocre system but should run fine.

Zickle · #3 02-08-2005, 01:21 AM

Graals playerlist does not support guild groups and is sometimes confused on where buddy and ignored players go.

NPC scripting change on in player mode (like x and y isnt where x and y used to be).

and I agree with you all on your remarks.

Curt1zzle · #4 02-08-2005, 03:44 AM

It doesn't have an out-of-window playerlist. I hate that!

Hiro · #5 02-08-2005, 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curt1zzle

It doesn't have an out-of-window playerlist. I hate that!

Amen!

I hate how it isn't like the old client.

HoudiniMan · #6 02-08-2005, 05:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hiro

Amen!

I hate how it isn't like the old client.

Well, now he can't monitor PMs with the game minimized.

Projectshifter · #7 02-08-2005, 05:25 AM

I was intending on redoing a PM system for the server I was once developing. It was more of a buddy list type thing, where you couldn't just PM anyone, they'd have to accept your messages :P

protagonist · #8 02-08-2005, 05:30 AM

Just a small problem; Graal 3D doesn't work.

Projectshifter · #9 02-08-2005, 05:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by protagonist

Just a small problem; Graal 3D doesn't work.

I have problems with my Linux version. Looking through it via console it is because it cannot download certain files and then segfaults once I fix those problems. More details in the Graal3.15 Linux thread :P

Admins · #10 02-08-2005, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HoudiniMan

My only major beef with Graal 3 (that can't be re-scripted) is that you can't resize the window. There are a couple pre-set resolutions to pick from, but that seems like a downgrade in technology here.

Why was resizing taken out?

I'm hoping the display font is a scripted thing I can change...

Anybody else have any major problems with Graal 3?

If you use the default driver (OpenGL) then the window can of course be resized, what is the problem ?

Benm00t · #11 02-08-2005, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curt1zzle

It doesn't have an out-of-window playerlist. I hate that!

Yes, i hate that also!

Ajira · #12 02-09-2005, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stefan

If you use the default driver (OpenGL) then the window can of course be resized, what is the problem ?

Like he said, what is the problem? The window can be resized just fine. And if you don't like the buddylist, just rescript it. It's not very hard.

HoudiniMan · #13 02-09-2005, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ajira

Like he said, what is the problem? The window can be resized just fine. And if you don't like the buddylist, just rescript it. It's not very hard.

I'll have to make sure this openGL is selected, it was locking my window to preset resolutions... Investigating now.

Ahh i see, I was too used to using the maximize window button, then hitting Alt+Enter to resize the window to my screen size (while not being in annoying 'full screen' mode).

This way i didn't have to drag it out myself each time, and i could still use other programs while running graal at full screen size.

Would be nice if the maximize button was brought back.

Spark910 · #14 02-09-2005, 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benm00t

Yes, i hate that also!

I hate all of the things you can do in v2 but can't do in v3. I don't understand the point in limiting everything. There was nothing wrong with the old PM system, player list, mouse etc... I didn't need chaning. Lots of useability has been removed in v3 in my opinion. I think the features of v2 should be intergrated into v3 so it's more easy to use.

Admins · #15 02-09-2005, 02:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spark910

I hate all of the things you can do in v2 but can't do in v3. I don't understand the point in limiting everything. There was nothing wrong with the old PM system, player list, mouse etc... I didn't need chaning. Lots of useability has been removed in v3 in my opinion. I think the features of v2 should be intergrated into v3 so it's more easy to use.

Limiting what? The only thing that doesn't work in v3.1 is an external player list

oinknessx · #16 02-09-2005, 03:38 AM

I have a beef for Graal 3.

I just wish Graal didn't use 99,000 memory on my comp... sure it doesn't seem like much since I have so much free, but it does make a difference... stuff moves slow on my comp when I play graal.

Spark910 · #17 02-09-2005, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stefan

Limiting what? The only thing that doesn't work in v3.1 is an external player list

-In game mouse (I don't like or see the need for it)
-Re sizing
-Player list (Old one in my opinion in way better)
-PM system (The PM window etc is better in v2)

There some pretty annoying things for me.

Skyld · #18 02-09-2005, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spark910

-In game mouse (I don't like or see the need for it)
-Re sizing
-Player list (Old one in my opinion in way better)
-PM system (The PM window etc is better in v2)

There some pretty annoying things for me.

- Linux client doesn't have it, so I cannot complain
- I can resize..?
- This can be rescripted
- This can also be rescripted

Admins · #19 02-09-2005, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spark910

-In game mouse (I don't like or see the need for it)

Only in full screen, on Mac you even have the normal mouse in full screen (On windows it cannot be guaranteed that the normal mouse works in fullscreen so the graphical mouse is displayed).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spark910

-Re sizing

Works

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spark910

-Player list (Old one in my opinion in way better)

Almost everything works now, except multi-selection and the guild section, those will be added soon though, also some more stuff, since the playerlist in v2.3 will be expanded too soon.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spark910

-PM system (The PM window etc is better in v2)

What is better with that ? x-x You can easily reply, you can see smileys, you have the history etc.

oinknessx · #20 02-09-2005, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stefan

Only in full screen, on Mac you even have the normal mouse in full screen (On windows it cannot be guaranteed that the normal mouse works in fullscreen so the graphical mouse is displayed).

Works

Almost everything works now, except multi-selection and the guild section, those will be added soon though, also some more stuff, since the playerlist in v2.3 will be expanded too soon.

What is better with that ? x-x You can easily reply, you can see smileys, you have the history etc.

I remember there used to be emoticons in PMs on GRAAL, but I haven't seen any lately.. whats up with that? Bring 'em back and make more! I want to say

on graal.

And also

And even better, we can make more in-game emoticons, like "please" (hey, you cant have sorry without please and thank you.)

Admins · #21 02-09-2005, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oinknessx

I remember there used to be emoticons in PMs on GRAAL, but I haven't seen any lately.. whats up with that? Bring 'em back and make more! I want to say

on graal.

And also

And even better, we can make more in-game emoticons, like "please" (hey, you cant have sorry without please and thank you.)

If you use things like : ) ; ) x _ x it is displaying the icons like

In v3.1 they are always displayed, in v2.3 only if you have images inside PMs enabled.

Crono · #22 02-09-2005, 05:15 PM

Graal 3 feels wierd. I'm happy with the old graal client, Graal 3 feels restricting and as much as I appreciate the work put into it I dont feel comfortable with it.

HoudiniMan · #23 02-10-2005, 05:00 AM

The movement is different... it doesn't handle the same.

Also, i've been having a lot of lag with the latest v2 client on my end...

Projectshifter · #24 02-10-2005, 06:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stefan

What is better with that ? x-x You can easily reply, you can see smileys, you have the history etc.

If Graal could spawn external windows it would be helpful. The external Playerlist was nice. I used to be able to be on a server was player and minimize it for a minute and still be able to see my PMs. Perhaps create some type of command for external windows? Would be nice.

Doahh_p2p · #25 02-10-2005, 04:18 PM

The playerlist is screwed up (Wayyyy out of order)

Can you also make it so buddylist from graal2 loads on graal3?

I don't want to copy / paste it all

(By The Way where is the playerlist script?)

Crono · #26 02-10-2005, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Projectshifter

If Graal could spawn external windows it would be helpful. The external Playerlist was nice. I used to be able to be on a server was player and minimize it for a minute and still be able to see my PMs. Perhaps create some type of command for external windows? Would be nice.

Exactly, thats why I feel restricted. There aren't seperate windows, just ingame windows which I feel sucks.

ApothiX · #27 02-12-2005, 06:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Projectshifter

If Graal could spawn external windows it would be helpful. The external Playerlist was nice. I used to be able to be on a server was player and minimize it for a minute and still be able to see my PMs. Perhaps create some type of command for external windows? Would be nice.

The minimize button has dissapeared too on the windows version, so minimizing and having the playerlist active is out of the question for windows users :P

Splke · #28 02-16-2005, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stefan

What is better with that ? x-x You can easily reply, you can see smileys, you have the history etc.

So html is enabled no matter what, or what? You do know that there are scripts you can send through PMs to manipulate the game into freezing/crashing, right?

Admins · #29 02-16-2005, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Splke

So html is enabled no matter what, or what? You do know that there are scripts you can send through PMs to manipulate the game into freezing/crashing, right?

It's our own HTML parser
Also we are working on merging v2.3 and v3.1 (new scripting, new gui, external playerlist, optional old gfx engine but may be support for 24 pngs)

maximus_asinus · #30 02-16-2005, 03:41 PM

- Still can't use the playerlist while paused.
- If you close the chat window, chat isn't deleted, and that does get a little annoying when you forgot you had typed something beforehand.
- Other options from the regular client don't work: ALT + 3 to remove the mini - map for example.
- Graal3 doesn't seem to support pressing multiple buttons as well as the original. (in game as well as chatting).
- Emoticons seem to disable your movement for a couple seconds when using them.
- (For me at least) - Changing from D3D to OpenGL or back pretty much stalls the game.
- Other shortcuts like pressing TAB and enter when you send PMs won't work.
- You cannot change the type of text you are using.

I'm sure I will think of more in a couple minutes. Might have been easier to quote protagonist.

Skyld · #31 02-16-2005, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maximus_asinus

- Still can't use the playerlist while paused.
- If you close the chat window, chat isn't deleted, and that does get a little annoying when you forgot you had typed something beforehand.
- Other options from the regular client don't work: ALT + 3 to remove the mini - map for example.
- Graal3 doesn't seem to support pressing multiple buttons as well as the original. (in game as well as chatting).
- Emoticons seem to disable your movement for a couple seconds when using them.
- (For me at least) - Changing from D3D to OpenGL or back pretty much stalls the game.
- Other shortcuts like pressing TAB and enter when you send PMs won't work.
- You cannot change the type of text you are using.

I'm sure I will think of more in a couple minutes. Might have been easier to quote protagonist.

I am unable to recreate some of these problems that you are having. I can use multiple buttons, emoticons do not freeze me, D3D <-> OpenGL does not freeze my client, and the chat window does not delete the text just like Graal 2.3 does not.
I can imagine that if the font was changeable, it would cause several problems for the GUI scripts such as the scripted RC, playerlist, serverlist, options dialog and more, since fonts are spaced differently.

maximus_asinus · #32 02-16-2005, 06:25 PM

Some of these problems might be only on classic

try pressing shift and backspace together with chat.

HoudiniMan · #33 02-18-2005, 02:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skyld

I can imagine that if the font was changeable, it would cause several problems for the GUI scripts such as the scripted RC, playerlist, serverlist, options dialog and more, since fonts are spaced differently.

The scripts for those has never been changeable, but I miss being able to change the text for in game chat, signs, etc.

I've also narrowed the clientside lag i've been having down to not all the time, but only when many players are in one level. What's the deal with that? I've never had this problem before and I'm using the same computer and connection.

Mitch · #34 02-23-2005, 08:22 AM

I really can't think of anything bad about it off hand. But I will think of something!

Wait... I remember that sword bug no one could hurt you but you hurt them ;p I blame stefan!

jake13jake · #35 02-26-2005, 06:41 AM

It could be cool if you could create new windows with graal3 instead of restricting it all into a single window. I would love the ability, as a player, to be able to skin my own state or playerlist.

Skyld · #36 02-26-2005, 12:00 PM

Pfft.
Graal 3 is better than Graal 2.3. It is becoming easier to rescript (Stefan has given us the RC and playerlist, more likely to come), it doesn't lag, it's GUI looks nice, it is skinnable (I believe; I'll check that up later), and it has Gscript2 clientside.

Admins · #37 02-26-2005, 03:29 PM

Graal v3 uses more video memory because in older Direct3D and OpenGL versions it was only possible to make textures with a width and height that are power of 2 (64, 128, 256 pixels etc.). I will check if the newer driver versions are fixing that, reducing that would probably reduce lag a lot if you have an older gfx card.

I have posted things about the Sword hurting bug in the Bugs/Tech support forum, it was a problem of people without guild tag not being able to hurt each other. A new version of 3.1 will be released soon.

Creating external windows might be quite interesting, we are considering adding that.

Update:
I have checked, it seems all new drivers of ATI and NVidia support non-power-of-2 textures. Cannot test right now because the Nvidia site is down.
We also plan to make the font rendering using polygons (ftgl library), which saves even more video memory.

Update:
Checked the latest Nvidia driver for my gfx card, and the texture-size optimization (non-power-of-2) doesn't seem to be enabled yet.

Update:
It works on my ATI card though, got it working nicely, so in the next v3.1 version it will use less video memory, if the gfx card and the driver support it.

jake13jake · #38 03-04-2005, 06:54 PM

You know what else might be good? The ability to redownload dead or updated images/ganis when a level is updated/created. I don't think Graal 3 does this, and I haven't heard anyone mention it.

Admins · #39 03-10-2005, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jake13jake

You know what else might be good? The ability to redownload dead or updated images/ganis when a level is updated/created. I don't think Graal 3 does this, and I haven't heard anyone mention it.

Normally Graal does that, at least works with v3.1, with v2 there were some problems with that but I can check it sometime.

HoudiniMan · #40 03-11-2005, 01:26 AM

I'd like to know where to edit the scripts for the v3 GUI