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Old 12-31-2013, 01:14 PM
Frankie Frankie is offline
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Gun distribution

I want to bring this discussion to it's own topic. any comments, ideas, suggestions, and criticism are welcome! I want to hear what people think about this kind of system.



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raiding isn't fun. pking isn't fun. sparring isn't fun. why? because of the weapons. there are too many lame weapons and too many weapons with stats that can clearly out gun any lower tiered weapon.

- get rid of the shoot-over-wall weapons.
- reduce the amount of weapons.
- the less weapons there are, the easier they are to balance, so balance them accordingly.
- make them easily accessible. take the focus off of the economy and money and make it game play.

I would even argue that every time you log on you should choose a certain load out of any 3 guns. completely get rid of the entire "gun economy." it won't matter if players have access to every gun because skill will now be the ultimate factor in success. different guns will only be preference of play style.

after the weapon situation is resolved, just pump out tons of game play content. quests, events, raid bonuses, whatever. the game would be so much more fun under these conditions.

put yourself into the shoes of a new player who logs onto the server for the first time ever. do you honestly think you'd bother to log onto the game ever again after a few hours, even minutes, of playing? probably not. the expectations of new players are so ridiculously high. you have to spend countless hours grinding tedious jobs in order to earn enough money to buy a some what decent gun, and then you're expected to just "get good" at the game. really? is that the best we can do here?

people can't buy cheap uzis and "get good" and stand a chance against those with a vast arsenal of weapons. that's not how it works anymore unfortunately. these players are just going to get **** on. they are at an extreme disadvantage. the learning curve on this server requires you to have good weapons. then you have to ask yourself, why should people learn how to pk and spar with cheap weapons when they can spend that time making more money to afford something better? basically they're better off spending the first few weeks of playing this game just grinding cash to afford something good before even beginning to practice and get good at the game.

realistically how will the server ever draw in a new player base under these conditions? it seems like the focus is to keep current players happy and make them not want to leave instead of bringing in new players. that's why the player count gets smaller and smaller. even "high" player counts these days consist of 20% idlers and 20% staff/RCs.

I can't be the only one that realizes the current system isn't working anymore. it needs to be changed. try something new for ****s sake.
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the only thing that would be changing is how guns are distributed. that's it really. instead of making players grind jobs for money to buy guns, why not put everyone on an even playing field from the very beginning? the core structure of the game will still be the same with a focus on pking, but players will be able to jump right into the action.

in my opinion the economy takes away from the potential of the game to be fun.

there can still be an economy of rare items, collectibles, and maybe introduce novelty weapons that aren't as good as the main group of weapons. this way players can still have a sense of "I have this and you don't." there can even be weapon skins that are limited in availability but the skin doesn't affect the stats of the gun.

I understand players like to collect things. this type of economy wouldn't interfere with the core game play in any way though. there will be players who like to collect rare items but then there will be players who don't care about that sort of stuff but will still get to enjoy the game. you get the best of both worlds.

anyone who opposes this idea would probably just be bitter towards the fact that they would lose their fortune of good weapons. with that kind of attitude you're just going to have a fancy inventory on an empty server. there's no fun in that. I'm sure players who have a lot of weaponry can be compensated in some way as well. keep an open mind.
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I don't think a reset would be necessary. I just want to get rid of the gun economy and keep everything else. there are still items that people worked hard for to collect that aren't a problem (like hats for example) but expensive weapons that are impossible for the average player to obtain that are heaps better than the guns they are using are a problem.

basically the trading economy would have absolutely no affect on core gameplay. this means you can't buy your way to successful pking. we'll have two types of players: the people who don't care about collectibles and only want a fun and well balanced gameplay experience, and the people who want more out of the game and will seek unique items.

think of xbox games and achievements. you have the people who will just play the game and have fun, then you have the people who will play the game but also hunt for all the achievements for a higher achievement score.

rich players will still be rich but just in a different way that doesn't give them significant advantages.
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  #2  
Old 12-31-2013, 06:51 PM
Tim_Rocks Tim_Rocks is offline
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I've already talked this over with a couple of people and did some quick brain storming. Here's the issues with your idea:
-How on earth do we compensate players?
-What's wrong with the gun stats anyway? I thought they were already balanced.
-The only thing rich players would be able to have if this is implemented is basically a business or a house. There's not a lot of other options after that.

Aside from what can go wrong, I also went around asking players what would make them interested in raiding or pking. I got a lot of mixed answers, which is normal... It seems like players want fast kills, and something they have that no one else has. Which leads me to believe that there's got to be something I can make for Era that could get players active. I have no idea what that is at the moment. One thing I can do though, is I do know how to make kills faster. And I was thinking making raids more event like. Faster re-spawns; Allow whoever is in control over the base to re-spawn in the base. Also, making multiple capture points so bases are a little more challenging than just waiting in a ring for 45 seconds. Players also told me they want locked down areas so players don't have far to run.. Lastly, make it so the only place you can go once you leave the base is the surrounding outside levels until the raid is over or you die.

Pick away at the ideas, kids!

Now, just so I'm clear though.. This is not an attack on you; I like your idea, I just don't think players would react well to it.
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Old 12-31-2013, 09:28 PM
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Old 12-31-2013, 10:09 PM
Supaman771 Supaman771 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim_Rocks View Post
Pick away at the ideas, kids!
OK!

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Originally Posted by Tim_Rocks View Post
-How on earth do we compensate players?
-What's wrong with the gun stats anyway? I thought they were already balanced.
-The only thing rich players would be able to have if this is implemented is basically a business or a house. There's not a lot of other options after that.
Why would you need to? The only thing you'd be inclined to compensate are potions because they were purchased with gelats, but you could just leave them alone since they don't impact game play as such.

They were. Then they weren't. Sometimes they are, most of the time they aren't. Honestly don't know anymore, though as soon as someone modifies one stat or adds one gun to the public after an established 'balance', it's essentially gone... Picture a scale, both sides set to an exact standard, any modification thus unbalances said scale.

The thing I don't see, is how rich is defined? Every player on the server has an equivalent set of multiple accessible inlets of theoretically infinite resources (in this case 'Money'). Coupled with the same accessibility of outlets to spend said resource (every gun, item, etc.) at set marks.
The only way I see fit to define rich, is whom can commit the most time to actively playing the game at any given point. Thus giving that player the highest rate of resource attainment.

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Originally Posted by Tim_Rocks View Post
It seems like players want fast kills, and something they have that no one else has.
So they want to be lazy and feel special. A type of behavior that shouldn't be encouraged.

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Originally Posted by Tim_Rocks View Post
And I was thinking making raids more event like. Faster re-spawns; Allow whoever is in control over the base to re-spawn in the base.
Just about everyone was in agreement that those 'BHPK' events made raiding redundant and pointless. Giving unskilled players free advantages to encourage them to not train/get better. One of the few things management actually agreed with us on (those events are now limited to be hosted).

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Originally Posted by Tim_Rocks View Post
Also, making multiple capture points so bases are a little more challenging than just waiting in a ring for 45 seconds.
Can't beat the players defending the control point?
Having difficulty staying alive while trying to attain advantages you don't deserve?
Never fear! There's now multiple circles so you can capture bases, while you don't actually capture bases!

Just 3 easy payments of $19.95! + S&H

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Originally Posted by Tim_Rocks View Post
Players also told me they want locked down areas so players don't have far to run.. Lastly, make it so the only place you can go once you leave the base is the surrounding outside levels until the raid is over or you die.
Links are already pk-mode disabled. Pk timers make hiding in unstick unavailable. Everything is child-proof to be easy as pie... though chasing and/or killing is a skill-required endeavor, if you can't do it... go practice instead of crying about it.

tl;dr
Nope

---------
As for the OP, I only read the bold statements. And it sounds like you need to type Zone into the 'Servername' bar.
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Old 01-01-2014, 02:39 AM
Zongui Zongui is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankie View Post
I want to bring this discussion to it's own topic. any comments, ideas, suggestions, and criticism are welcome! I want to hear what people think about this kind of system.
didn't zone do something similar? I remember that server. it died pretty fast. edit: i don't remember much about zone, but wasn't it purely a pk server? you got weapons from getting kills and all that. i don't think money was involved. anyone confirm?

and that other topic with 101 posts is closed, but i wanted to bring up some stuff in that topic. since this topic is related to what was being talked about in that closed topic, i will bring up my stuff in this topic.

people in the closed topic were talking about era not being noob friendly and all that, and how that is why people aren't having fun anymore. you guys were talking about doing different things to change all of that, but how about giving era police access to the "create a custom gang gun" option?

anyone can join era police and all the noobs who play era for the first time will be able to join era police and pick up their very own "OP" gang gun that the top 8 or whatever gangs on era already have. that way all the noobs will be on equal footing with these veteran players that have had time to become more experienced on era. i am sure those noobs will have fun.

wasn't making era more fun the premise of your guys' argument for wanting to change era?

Last edited by Zongui; 01-01-2014 at 08:42 AM.. Reason: wasn't sure about the server zone
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Old 01-01-2014, 02:52 AM
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I personally love the idea, I would play a server that was like this.
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  #7  
Old 01-01-2014, 03:02 AM
Fiberwyre_P2P Fiberwyre_P2P is offline
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how about giving era police access to the "create a custom gang gun" option?
I support this.
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Old 01-01-2014, 04:43 AM
Tim_Rocks Tim_Rocks is offline
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buncha ****
It's comments like these that result in nothing getting done. Players wanting fast kills isn't something that Era started doing. It's games like Call of Duty or other mainstream shooter games that encouraged an entire generation of kids to want things "RIGHT NOW". I remember when I had to drive all the way to Wal-Mart to buy a game, now I got a nephew buying games straight to his console without ever leaving his room. Anyway, the point I'm trying to make here is that if players want fast kills, then shouldn't we make the game a little faster paced?

Side note, give Era Police their own gang gun. Just make limits so there can only be 4 or 5 active guns at one point.
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Old 01-01-2014, 08:05 AM
Godzilla Godzilla is offline
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Frankie's weapon loadout scheme is probably the best idea I've heard in a VERY long time, It's near flawless in my opinion, especially if everyone keeps crying about gun balancing, wanting the game to be more PK focused and skill based.

Why do you need to compensate the rich when most of the rich are the ones asking for the game to be PK focused.

In my opinion; 5 sets of 3 gun loadouts all being a primary, secondary and third(ary), making them all balanced with each other but result in a skill-ful debate/player preference.

When players get bored you can cycle in new loadouts and cycle out the old until another 3-6 months to cycle them back in, you wouldn't even need to delete the guns on Era just the ID so no one owns guns anymore, thus being able to cycle through the 60+ weapons on Era.
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Old 01-01-2014, 08:50 AM
Zongui Zongui is offline
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Originally Posted by Tim_Rocks View Post
It's comments like these that result in nothing getting done. Players wanting fast kills isn't something that Era started doing. It's games like Call of Duty or other mainstream shooter games that encouraged an entire generation of kids to want things "RIGHT NOW". I remember when I had to drive all the way to Wal-Mart to buy a game, now I got a nephew buying games straight to his console without ever leaving his room. Anyway, the point I'm trying to make here is that if players want fast kills, then shouldn't we make the game a little faster paced?

Side note, give Era Police their own gang gun. Just make limits so there can only be 4 or 5 active guns at one point.
i think 10 active guns only would be good since the member limit for real gangs is 10.
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Old 01-01-2014, 08:52 AM
Zongui Zongui is offline
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Frankie's weapon loadout scheme is probably the best idea I've heard in a VERY long time, It's near flawless in my opinion, especially if everyone keeps crying about gun balancing, wanting the game to be more PK focused and skill based.

Why do you need to compensate the rich when most of the rich are the ones asking for the game to be PK focused.

In my opinion; 5 sets of 3 gun loadouts all being a primary, secondary and third(ary), making them all balanced with each other but result in a skill-ful debate/player preference.

When players get bored you can cycle in new loadouts and cycle out the old until another 3-6 months to cycle them back in, you wouldn't even need to delete the guns on Era just the ID so no one owns guns anymore, thus being able to cycle through the 60+ weapons on Era.
i just think this change is too radical. i really don't think it is necessary.
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Old 01-01-2014, 09:06 AM
-HateD- -HateD- is offline
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Tertiary is the word you're looking for not thirdary haha.
Anyways rogue is right the server would kind of just turn into zone. which died.
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Old 01-01-2014, 09:48 AM
Godzilla Godzilla is offline
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Tertiary is the word you're looking for not thirdary haha.
Anyways rogue is right the server would kind of just turn into zone. which died.
Hahaha, I knew I was wrong but I wasn't ready to go ahead and start googling it.

I don't think Era would turn into Zone at all or die, if anything the server would bloom off of the update but It would be a big game-changing update so I understand the scared-ness of failure hanging over the Staff Teams head.

In all honesty, the server isn't in too bad of a position, it's just the terrible community and spiteful staff team that make the game not so fun.
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Old 01-01-2014, 09:03 PM
Frankie Frankie is offline
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you guys seem to be missing a very important piece to my whole argument

Quote:
put yourself into the shoes of a new player who logs onto the server for the first time ever. do you honestly think you'd bother to log onto the game ever again after a few hours, even minutes, of playing? probably not. the expectations of new players are so ridiculously high. you have to spend countless hours grinding tedious jobs in order to earn enough money to buy a some what decent gun, and then you're expected to just "get good" at the game. really? is that the best we can do here?

people can't buy cheap uzis and "get good" and stand a chance against those with a vast arsenal of weapons. that's not how it works anymore unfortunately. these players are just going to get **** on. they are at an extreme disadvantage. the learning curve on this server requires you to have good weapons. then you have to ask yourself, why should people learn how to pk and spar with cheap weapons when they can spend that time making more money to afford something better? basically they're better off spending the first few weeks of playing this game just grinding cash to afford something good before even beginning to practice and get good at the game.

realistically how will the server ever draw in a new player base under these conditions? it seems like the focus is to keep current players happy and make them not want to leave instead of bringing in new players. that's why the player count gets smaller and smaller. even "high" player counts these days consist of 20% idlers and 20% staff/RCs.
in my opinion, the current economy makes it impossible for players to reasonably achieve enough assets to play this game fairly. I stress the word reasonably because realistically one could grind a job for hours and hours to make a lot of money, but who the **** wants to do that? nobody.

you log into the game and you're at unstick me. you see all these players with fancy weapons and you see people pking around you and you want to jump in on the action? too bad. grab a drill and start mining your life away. sure you can mine for a little while and buy an ak47 for $1000, but as a new player you're going to get mowed down easily.

some people will argue "well you have to practice and get better. stats don't matter you can acquire skill and stand a chance!" wrong. lets be ****ing real here, that's not happening. players who have been playing for months/years with weapons that FAR out-class the starter weapon shop weapons will always have an advantage. always!

so here's where the gun load out system comes in. everyone weapon-wise is on an even playing field. the skilled players will still be able to out gun others, but this time they aren't hiding behind a 500k weapon that other people don't have. if you get destroyed by someone using an mp40, you can pick up an mp40 and start practicing with that weapon and hold a better chance against them. it's fair and it's 100% skill based. I feel like people who are denying this type of system are scared that they are just going to suck horribly at the game. it really puts into perspective how much expensive and over powered weapons influence someone's "skill."

it's just an idea. it has flaws, it has concerns, it has disagreements. if you enjoy this game how it is right now, that's great. you are well within perfect reasoning to disagree with my proposal. can we all at least agree that there's something broken about this game that needs to be fixed so we can attract new players and increase the player count and player activity? but I feel like everyone tries to pin point the lack of player activity behind gangs and raiding and I really think we need to take a step back and look at the bigger picture. gang and raid content is not the reason why people don't want to play. don't be so close-minded. your over powered weapons aren't going to do you any good on a server that nobody wants to play.

again, in my opinion.
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Last edited by Frankie; 01-01-2014 at 09:17 PM..
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  #15  
Old 01-01-2014, 09:35 PM
Zongui Zongui is offline
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"you log into the game and you're at unstick me. you see all these players with fancy weapons and you see people pking around you and you want to jump in on the action? too bad. grab a drill and start mining your life away. sure you can mine for a little while and buy an ak47 for $1000, but as a new player you're going to get mowed down easily."

those noobs can join EP and get their own fancy gun from the EP locker. the new gang admin just needs to add that create a gun option for EP. then they will be stylin' with their fancy .05 freeze gun or whatever. everyone will be having fun.

i am actually against putting a limit on the number of weapons out for EP members, but if it must be done, then i'll stick by that 10.
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