Graal Forums  

Go Back   Graal Forums > PlayerWorlds > Classic Main Forum > Classic Bugs and suggestions
FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 07-19-2012, 05:16 AM
ffcmike ffcmike is offline
Banned
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: London
Posts: 2,029
ffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to ffcmike Send a message via MSN to ffcmike
Whackanoob Dialogue Suggestions

Some may remember an old minigame I had within the GC Studios called Whackanoob, which was basically a version of Whackamole where you'd hammer newbies, some of which would be saying irritating/frustrating/comical things.

This is now being remade into a proper studio event. If anyone has any suggestions for some funny things for the newbies to say feel free to post here or let me know.

I currently have:

Quote:
can i b admin?
where is bush farm?
classic pc sux it has a small map
reportin u 2 admins
whats ur head code?
where yin yang in box?
plz dont kill me!
how to make bubbles?
can i join ur guild plz?
r u hiring?
lookin 4 GF
pwease adopt me!
where is the Graal?
Hello my name is Link
u shud make an events house
no n e good codes?
omg dis hit detection is wrong!
lagger
where do i buy hats?
how do i ipod?
do u no stephan?
r u admin?
y u kill me?
i can haz ep plz?
can u drag me?
where do i get sword?
i need a mommy
Secret Azure is my bff! //note this was his own suggestion
/sit
/dance
recruiting 4 my clan
u no where 2 get hammer?
bring back the hug gani!
wat is the script for the hammer?
where do u get a horse?
can u giv me ur scripts?
/leave
r u single?
how 2 cap flag?
can u invite me 2 da event?
add me 2 event plz
can u show me ur ganis?
u shud make me lat i no how 2 add warp links
friendship is magic
Poor spelling/grammar is encouraged.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-19-2012, 05:30 AM
Imperialistic Imperialistic is offline
graal player lord
Imperialistic's Avatar
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,094
Imperialistic is a jewel in the roughImperialistic is a jewel in the rough
Quote:
Originally Posted by ffcmike View Post
irritating/frustrating/comical....things.
graal support
__________________
" It's been swell, but the swelling's gone down. "
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 07-19-2012, 05:37 AM
Hezzy002 Hezzy002 is offline
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 247
Hezzy002 is a jewel in the roughHezzy002 is a jewel in the rough
pls rate gp
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 07-19-2012, 11:27 AM
Minoc Minoc is offline
Registered User
Minoc's Avatar
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,385
Minoc is a splendid one to beholdMinoc is a splendid one to beholdMinoc is a splendid one to beholdMinoc is a splendid one to beholdMinoc is a splendid one to behold
ill hack ur account
my friend is gm i can get u bant
how do i join gp
noob!
__________________
-
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 07-19-2012, 11:42 AM
gravator gravator is offline
Joe Cruddas (VIP)
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 279
gravator has a spectacular aura about
U MAD?

n# y u no whack? (I think n# is the one that shows nickname and not account name.)

Trololo
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 07-19-2012, 02:31 PM
Crono Crono is offline
:pluffy:
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Sweden
Posts: 20,000
Crono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to Crono
lookn 4 gst team!!

Quote:
omg dis hit detection is wrong!
A noob wouldn't say this and even if they did, they're right.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 07-19-2012, 02:36 PM
Pandar Pandar is offline
Babylon Co-Manager
Pandar's Avatar
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 68
Pandar has a spectacular aura aboutPandar has a spectacular aura about
Quote:
Originally Posted by Imperialistic View Post
graal support
__________________
R.I.P. Graal (1998 - 2004)
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 07-19-2012, 04:56 PM
ffcmike ffcmike is offline
Banned
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: London
Posts: 2,029
ffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to ffcmike Send a message via MSN to ffcmike
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minoc View Post
ill hack ur account
my friend is gm i can get u bant
Good suggestions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Minoc View Post
noob!
Not sure why I didn't think of this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crono View Post
A noob wouldn't say this and even if they did, they're right.
You'd be surprised how many people have been parroting remarks about the hit detection simply because they're aware of how terrible it was in the past, and in some cases aren't even aware the old serverside one was scrapped. It has also been adopted by certain newer players, sometimes through mimicking, sometimes by defaulting to excuses after successive losses, in the same way someone might accuse someone who beat them of hacking.

As for whether it's right or wrong, nobody can ever come up with a reasonable explanation as to why they believe it is wrong. The vast majority of the time it's "I hit them on my screen and they didn't get hurt" and sometimes "the people watching the spar saw me hit them too", which is ofcourse not how default hit detection is supposed to work, as it's a matter of your opponent seeing you hit them on their screen.
I've even heard ridiculous reasons ranging from "the steps.wav sound in the gani isn't the same as the default walk gani" to "the arena is the wrong size".

It would be good if someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that default HD scans the gani/sprite of other players on your client, and if they're slashing, checks an intersect of 32 x 32 pixels offset by their direction from their body's blocking area, with a 32 x 32 pixel box of your own body's blocking area. I have an online debug level displaying polygons over these boxes which matches perfectly with an offline equivalent level (hence default).

It is also my understanding that default recoil moves the player at 1 tile distance per frame according to the hit angle, for 5 frames. That blink lasts between 0.55 - 1.95 seconds (again, good if someone can correct me if I'm wrong) according to release of held arrow keys or slashing. Recoil is also sticking players to walls.

The only very slight difference I can admit to, is that our movement speed is pixel rounded, whereas default level 3 shield speed being at 0.6 tiles per frame is not pixel perfect.

Unless I were to actually see the client's code or somebody were to offer a credible explanation as to why they think it might be wrong, there's nothing more I can do to possibly make it more similar, other than some speculative experimentation with what order things might be occurring with default, or if player slashes are scanned for multiple times within the same frame.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 07-19-2012, 09:42 PM
Crono Crono is offline
:pluffy:
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Sweden
Posts: 20,000
Crono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to Crono
Quote:
Originally Posted by ffcmike View Post
Unless I were to actually see the client's code or somebody were to offer a credible explanation as to why they think it might be wrong
I already told you what was wrong ingame. Hitting people from a mile away is not normal and nothing of the sort happens on UN or iClassic with or without TCP. I don't know if it's the movement system or hit detection, but from a player perspective it doesnt really matter; something is off.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 07-19-2012, 10:10 PM
ffcmike ffcmike is offline
Banned
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: London
Posts: 2,029
ffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to ffcmike Send a message via MSN to ffcmike
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crono View Post
I already told you what was wrong ingame. Hitting people from a mile away is not normal and nothing of the sort happens on UN or iClassic with or without TCP. I don't know if it's the movement system or hit detection, but from a player perspective it doesnt really matter; something is off.
Going by the Clientside mechanism Default works by, it's perfectly plausible to hit somebody from a far distance according to your own perspective. If the time it takes for data to go from your computer to your opponent's computer is high enough (such as against someone with a ping into the thousands), you could even hit somebody from the opposite side of the arena according to your own perspective, provided their client detects an intersect.

When you have 2 Europeans sparring eachother using TCP, there's always going to be a big delay between slashes going from one to the other, as the data is having to travel all the way from Europe to the USA, and then back to the opponent in Europe. A decent UDP transfer among 2 Europeans would change the situation entirely, as data would then not be having to travel so far to and from 2 Europeans.

I've seen videos of spars on UN and iPhone, tested default early in Classic's development as well as pre-wipe, opened up Dev Polo plus an arena (using default) on one occasion where most of the servers were down, and even sparred against a crowd of people on that place which is considered a taboo, guessing ahead of time to successfully hit an opponent inwhich there's a delay seems completely normal to me.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 07-19-2012, 10:35 PM
Crono Crono is offline
:pluffy:
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Sweden
Posts: 20,000
Crono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond reputeCrono has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to Crono
. . .

Classic's current hit detection is weird under certain circumstances where it isn't on UN, iClassic, or other "default" servers in the past. I don't really know what else to say, but something is off about it.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 07-19-2012, 11:02 PM
ffcmike ffcmike is offline
Banned
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: London
Posts: 2,029
ffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to ffcmike Send a message via MSN to ffcmike
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crono View Post
. . .

Classic's current hit detection is weird under certain circumstances where it isn't on UN, iClassic, or other "default" servers in the past. I don't really know what else to say, but something is off about it.
As a result of the default level 3 speed being 0.6 tiles per frame, a value which can not be divided into whole pixels, your characters display is rounded to the nearest whole pixel coordinate, which is also the value synchronised to the server and other players, while your actual clientside x/y values remain at decimal pixel values. Because of this, with default it is actually possible to see your character edge-on with another players sword, but you don't get hit because your absolute x/y value could be up to half a pixel away from that visible edge. The opposite can also be true, the synchronised value may be closer to your opponent than your absolute x/y value, which can result in your opponents client detecting a hit even though you were really up to half a pixel too far away.

That is the only difference I can account for, and if anything Classic's method is more accurate, as the visible coordinate matches the absolute coordinate on your client.

On the other hand, there have also been those with experience who have been complimentary of the new system, who've said it feels right. When developing it I would even swap it around with Default and people who were on PKing couldn't tell the difference, though that may well have been the fact it was level 1 shield speed of 0.5 tiles per frame, which is pixel perfect.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 07-19-2012, 11:07 PM
Imperialistic Imperialistic is offline
graal player lord
Imperialistic's Avatar
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,094
Imperialistic is a jewel in the roughImperialistic is a jewel in the rough
I would have to agree with Crono, I think thats why Classic was never really a huge sparring server. The hit detection is very awkward and weird especially if you're used to the other 'default' servers, it almost makes it frustrating.
__________________
" It's been swell, but the swelling's gone down. "
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 07-19-2012, 11:09 PM
maximus_asinus maximus_asinus is offline
RIP DarkCloud_PK
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Canada
Posts: 3,731
maximus_asinus has a reputation beyond reputemaximus_asinus has a reputation beyond reputemaximus_asinus has a reputation beyond reputemaximus_asinus has a reputation beyond reputemaximus_asinus has a reputation beyond reputemaximus_asinus has a reputation beyond reputemaximus_asinus has a reputation beyond reputemaximus_asinus has a reputation beyond reputemaximus_asinus has a reputation beyond reputemaximus_asinus has a reputation beyond repute
Thor is right, what Crono described used to happen all the time on default. You would spar someone on 28.8k or 56k modem (or they were intentionally lagging) and the only defense for this was to swing where they were going which made it appear as if you were swinging across the screen.
__________________
Save Classic!
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 07-19-2012, 11:14 PM
ffcmike ffcmike is offline
Banned
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: London
Posts: 2,029
ffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond reputeffcmike has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to ffcmike Send a message via MSN to ffcmike
Quote:
Originally Posted by ffcmike View Post
As a result of the default level 3 speed being 0.6 tiles per frame, a value which can not be divided into whole pixels, your characters display is rounded to the nearest whole pixel coordinate, which is also the value synchronised to the server and other players, while your actual clientside x/y values remain at decimal pixel values. Because of this, with default it is actually possible to see your character edge-on with another players sword, but you don't get hit because your absolute x/y value could be up to half a pixel away from that visible edge. The opposite can also be true, the synchronised value may be closer to your opponent than your absolute x/y value, which can result in your opponents client detecting a hit even though you were really up to half a pixel too far away.

That is the only difference I can account for, and if anything Classic's method is more accurate, as the visible coordinate matches the absolute coordinate on your client.
Incase this is hard to understand, perhaps this picture from Dev Polo (default) will explain it more easily:




Quote:
Originally Posted by Imperialistic View Post
The hit detection is very awkward and weird especially if you're used to the other 'default' servers, it almost makes it frustrating.
So what's weird about it compared to default exactly?
There's nothing more I can do unless someone can actually explain it, and it's not another case of "I hit people on my screen and they don't get hurt".
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 04:10 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright (C) 1998-2019 Toonslab All Rights Reserved.