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View Poll Results: Classic Server should..?
be left as it is. 4 6.15%
bring back it's original levels and hit detection. 51 78.46%
bring back ONLY the original levels but leave the hit detection as is. 1 1.54%
bring back ONLY the original hit detection but leave the levels as is. 9 13.85%
Voters: 65. You may not vote on this poll

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  #616  
Old 05-24-2009, 08:04 PM
Tyhm Tyhm is offline
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I stopped bothering when it became apparent I wasn't going to beat Sardon's Boss Monstar, and I wouldn't be allowed to do anything else until I did. Baddy Hit Detection had a lot to do with it, as did the absence of other quests ramping up in difficulty; it was pretty much "here's a nothing quest, and now here's a quest where you die arbitrarily and need to do a perfect run to stand a chance."
Seriously. The shootball scripts would just decide that when they hit anything, to hurt the player. Pretty sure Thor fixed them to some degree, but still, not okay. Plus I still take issue with CLASSIC deciding to arbitrarily double the HP of all the DEFAULT BADDIES. I can handle bad HD when there's a workaround or when the quest wasn't that hard to begin with, but when it's "you get hit from across the room because it's a little laggy, your hits don't register half the time, and it takes thirty seconds of not getting arbirarily hit to set up a shot, also there's a trick to defeating the boss that requires realizing that one of your attacks (that doesn't connect most of the time) is the only thing that does damage"....man, screw that.
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  #617  
Old 05-24-2009, 08:26 PM
DustyPorViva DustyPorViva is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nelm View Post
I agree. Classic is stagnant, development is at a crawl - at best, and there isn't a lot to offer in terms of game play. However, can you really expect management to listen to players who don't frequent their server? I'd be interested to see how many people would actually play on Classic if the HD was default. My guess is that it wouldn't make much of a difference as Classic's problems extend far beyond the HD and movement issues.
Staff should listen to anyone who puts out a compelling and constructive argument, regardless of if they're frequent players or not. Players should not have to force themselves to play a server they don't enjoy just to get an opinion that matters.
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  #618  
Old 05-24-2009, 08:31 PM
Nelm Nelm is offline
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Originally Posted by DustyPorViva View Post
Staff should listen to anyone who puts out a compelling and constructive argument, regardless of if they're frequent players or not. Players should not have to force themselves to play a server they don't enjoy just to get an opinion that matters.
Fair enough. But from what I can see, staff have put out a compelling and constructive argument against the proposal. All we are doing is beating this topic to death. As long as Storm is the manager, the HD is staying, the way I see it. I don't care for the system, but nothing is changing in that regard. So why as players are we still focusing on this instead of throwing out ideas that will actually be considered and can be implemented?
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  #619  
Old 05-24-2009, 08:37 PM
DustyPorViva DustyPorViva is offline
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Originally Posted by Nelm View Post
Fair enough. But from what I can see, staff have put out a compelling and constructive argument against the proposal. All we are doing is beating this topic to death. As long as Storm is the manager, the HD is staying, the way I see it. I don't care for the system, but nothing is changing in that regard. So why as players are we still focusing on this instead of throwing out ideas that will actually be considered and can be implemented?
Their only argument is that it'll be too much work. Then some say that it will eventually be replaced with default, but they're willing to continue adding content that uses custom, which will eventually mean more work for them because they will have to replace all the content using the custom system now, AND whatever they add from hereon out.

I don't see this custom system as something that will last Classics lifetime, so eventually it will be replaced with another custom system or default or something, but I don't think it's going to be around forever. Classic as seen countless custom systems, conversion from pre-NPC server to NPC-server. Conversion from clientside to serverside. Conversion from regular maps to gmap. And what seems to be 5 years of just fiddling with systems rather than content, going from this system to the next. I don't think it's as much work, or going to be that huge of a set-back as they make it out to be.

Honestly, I gave up trying, but I still hope they will eventually convert to default, or at least a custom system that emulates it instead of thinking they can do it better.
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  #620  
Old 05-24-2009, 09:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DustyPorViva View Post
Their only argument is that it'll be too much work.
Their only argument, and the only one they need, is that it'll be far too much work for the lackluster staff we currently have, not to mention it'd take months of time to complete.

Would classic survive those several months with minimal changes while this project is being worked on? It's debatable, but I'd guess no. Regardless, IMO we should simply try to improve things as much as possible and put this HD project on hold until our staff team is built up.

Is this the best course of action? Like everything else, thats debatable. But whether you agree or not, the people in charge, for whatever reason, aren't simply going to bend to every foreign whim, whether they played 8 years ago or not.
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  #621  
Old 05-24-2009, 09:49 PM
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Hiring more lackluster staff is going to make things worse, which is all they seem to be doing.
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Seriously, you have ****-all for content and you're not exactly pulling in new developer talent, angling for prestigious titles should be your last concern.
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  #622  
Old 05-24-2009, 10:41 PM
MysticX2X MysticX2X is offline
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Hiring more lackluster staff is going to make things worse, which is all they seem to be doing.
I'm sick and tired of you and your friends slandering development staff who you see fit not into your eyes. Or actually anyone who gives their honest effort into helping Classic. You want Classic to release content, but for anybody to step up to the plate, that isn't 'quality' to your eyes, you make public and private insults at them, when they have not even released anything yet.(Or for recent cases, have only had their RC for 5 minutes). I've told the same thing to Luda when he decided to be a douchebag to me. Graal was made upon the basis of player-created content. Nothing has to be picture perfect, but with the right idea and effort is what's needed. The greatly wanted old levels didn't have the best designs to them when I looked through them, but I will assume that it was the gameplay which was more over appreciated.

You make your accusations off of unfinished content that is not supposed to be shown to non staff members, which imposes Staff transgressions.

If you want to help, I suggest shutting up. Maybe things might get released faster that way. I don't care if I am staff and telling you this. The people you call quality are the most disrespectful people ever. You actually used to not be an ass before.

I'm not here to argue, nor will I probably reply back, but I don't understand why you continue to play Classic if this is how you feel about current and future development. I've always wondered this in fact.
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  #623  
Old 05-24-2009, 10:48 PM
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  #624  
Old 05-24-2009, 11:06 PM
Rufus Rufus is offline
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This is what has got Classic in the mess that it is currently in. Rush to fill in the content void, blame the fact that it's Classic for the lack of quality, and worry about the stigma attached to that content later. It is such a poor and amateur way of developing, and that is not what Classic needs at all.
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So, to return to the point I'm trying to make here; In a server revival quality is paramount, especially if the content is not particularly unique. Content shouldn't be released for the sake of having content. Release content for the sake of being a better server. Classic is up to the point now where most of the game mechanics and game lore is offered elsewhere, and at a greater quality to boot, so if they're going to add a similar feature to Classic they need to go all the way with it or not put it in at all. First impressions are everything, and as this current playerbase isn't all too familiar with the old content, most of the re-releases are new releases. Players are not going to feel the same sense of joy, hype, gratitude, fondness (and all those other positive feelings you get when you play on a decent game you've been waiting for) to a "better" re-release of a re-release further down the line, so these initial releases need to be of quality. More importantly we need longevity in content, so a delay in a release is totally worth it as long as the product has a more professional finish to it when it finally does release.
I didn't even need to write out a reply. This is a server revival and what I outlined in my quoted text has a heightened effect with increased hirings of scrubby and talentless staff. Good luck getting real developers to work alongside that.. y'know.. the level of skill that Classic actually needs for a revival. There isn't much time left for this either.
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Seriously, you have ****-all for content and you're not exactly pulling in new developer talent, angling for prestigious titles should be your last concern.
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  #625  
Old 05-24-2009, 11:37 PM
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I think the problem is less of Classic hiring "scrubby and talentless" staff and more of the talented developers not stepping up and working for Classic. This could be for multiple reasons, but if they're hiring "scrubs", they're obviously desperate for help. So where are the "talented developers"?
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  #626  
Old 05-24-2009, 11:42 PM
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I think the problem is less of Classic hiring "scrubby and talentless" staff and more of the talented developers not stepping up and working for Classic.
Would you work on a server if you believed that you were pulling the team? Would you work on a server if you knew that the content that the other developers were making would need to be remade? Would you work on a server if you knew that the release of content that the crappy developers were making was punching its reputation further into the ground? How about working on a server where you feel you're working by yourself? Doesn't seem like a very nice setting to me.

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This could be for multiple reasons, but if they're hiring "scrubs", they're obviously desperate for help. So where are the "talented developers"?
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Seriously, you have ****-all for content and you're not exactly pulling in new developer talent, angling for prestigious titles should be your last concern.
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  #627  
Old 05-24-2009, 11:58 PM
MysticX2X MysticX2X is offline
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  #628  
Old 05-25-2009, 12:03 AM
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Yes, because everything you wrote was made of facts right?
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Seriously, you have ****-all for content and you're not exactly pulling in new developer talent, angling for prestigious titles should be your last concern.
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  #629  
Old 05-25-2009, 12:06 AM
Nelm Nelm is offline
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Originally Posted by Rufus View Post
Would you work on a server if you believed that you were pulling the team? Would you work on a server if you knew that the content that the other developers were making would need to be remade? Would you work on a server if you knew that the release of content that the crappy developers were making was punching its reputation further into the ground? How about working on a server where you feel you're working by yourself? Doesn't seem like a very nice setting to me.
I don't get it. SOMEONE has to step up and be the person to break the cycle. I WOULD work if I felt I was pulling the team. I WOULD remake content that needed to be remade. However, if I were in this position, I would be doing my best to help the other Devs so that this wasn't an issue. I WOULD be the person trying to turn the ship around instead of being a person standing by watching it sink. If I had to work or feel like I'm by myself, I would do it.

Sometimes you have to put yourself aside and if you care about something as much as all these people who are complaining about Classic are, why is NO ONE willing to be the person responsible for turning this around? How is anything going to change if no one is willing to put the effort, and be a consistent positive influence in development?

I'm not pointing anyone out here, but someone has to be willing to step up who is fed up with all this. Otherwise, we'll be in this thread debating what SHOULD be done with Classic in 5 years.

Good post and info there. But it still doesn't change the fact that the cycle needs to be broken.
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  #630  
Old 05-25-2009, 12:12 AM
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