Testbed Server

[Tigairius]

It's pretty common for old scripters from Graal to return and be completely lost in the new scripting language. It's also common for people who want to learn how to script to not have the proper resources.

I think we can really boost the scripter pool by providing a 'test' server for scripters to practice their skills and mess around on. It would need to be moderated by trusted scripters who can act professional. That's not my concern though:

- There would be inherit security risks with giving a bunch of scripters rights on a server, but can you think of anyone really abusing GS2? Generally scripters just want a place to script. Not abuse.

- I know this has been discussed before, but what if we actually do it? Do you have suggestions on how it should be run? Each scripter would get their own folder and then perhaps we could have a DBNPC monitor levels so that scripters can have 'private' levels if necessary?


Does anyone have any other suggestions/ideas? If we could expand this out of just scripting it would be great, a 'Developer Testing Server' for even level makers and graphics people to test their work. There would have to be certain rules on this server too in order to protect uploaded content so people can't steal it for their own server, etc.

I think it's time we try to improve the Graal developer pool. What do you guys say?

[DustyPorViva]

I did this with Developers Circle, but sadly it didn't garner enough attention to keep it actively used, so the owner took it back.

[cbk1994]

I agree, this would be a great way for new scripters to learn. Would be best if it was official, so that Stefan could adjust the server to give access to everyone and give them rights automatically. I don't know if he'd be willing to do that, however.

You'd also have problems with people abusing things like destroy(). For example, findWeapon( "Tigairius/WeaponIWorkedHardOn" ).destroy() which would delete that weapon. That would probably have to be fixed, likely by Stefan.

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by DustyPorViva

I did this with Developers Circle, but sadly it didn't garner enough attention to keep it actively used, so the owner took it back.

That's kind of what I figured would happen with this server, which is why I'm putting it here to see if it's even worth the time.

Originally Posted by cbk1994

You'd also have problems with people abusing things like destroy(). For example, findWeapon( "Tigairius/WeaponIWorkedHardOn" ).destroy() which would delete weapon. That would probably have to be fixed, likely by Stefan.

Yes, that's also very true, I already figured we'd need to get Stefan involved.

[LoneAngelIbesu]

It would be a great idea, if you could get Stefan and Unixmad to agree on Lifetime subscribers being able to access it, too.

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by LoneAngelIbesu

Lifetime subscribers being able to access it

I agree.

It's pretty obvious that if we wanted this to be a successful idea the GServer would need to be customized. However, if everyone could have access to it then it could be a great way for developers to team up and meet each other. It could only improve the quality of Graal.

[HoudiniMan]

When I had the idea I did think of a lot of reasons this wouldn't work.

Abusing it is the biggest one we would have to deal with...

But for now let's just DO IT. We can find trustworthy people to manage it and if somebody abuses their access we remove it.

Let's just do it and get some momentum.

NOW!

[Inverness]

Inverness agrees. And you can prevent a simple serverside destroy in a weapon by defining destroy().

[Chompy]

But, who would manage the server though?

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by Chompy

But, who would manage the server though?

Global Scripting Team and PWA along with a few other trusted developers.

[Chompy]

Originally Posted by Tigairius

Global Scripting Team and PWA along with a few other trusted developers.

Sounds good.

[Deas_Voice]

great!

so, we are getting a server or is it going to be a player owner server?

[Tigairius]

We can start small for now though, if we can get a server to start it on we can get this started. It was Houdini's idea to begin with, so he'll be helping manage it and then we'll build from there.

We need to find means of a server though. We'll get it started ASAP instead of sitting around talking about it. At first you'll need to let us know that you want an RC there, then you can have it. Maybe in the future it can be such a large server that everyone can automatically have their own little 'corner' to themselves without even having to ask.

[cbk1994]

Originally Posted by Inverness

Inverness agrees. And you can prevent a simple serverside destroy in a weapon by defining destroy().

Yeah, but it would be ideal if Stefan could simply disable that on the testbed server, since this is for, after all, new scripters, who may not know this. I didn't know it, either

[napo_p2p]

I like this idea. Plus, I get asked a lot of questions, and it would be nice to have a special place to help people directly with their scripts.

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by napo_p2p

I like this idea. Plus, I get asked a lot of questions, and it would be nice to have a special place to help people directly with their scripts.

Exactly. It would be ideal for this.

[HoudiniMan]

Originally Posted by cbk1994

Yeah, but it would be ideal if Stefan could simply disable that on the testbed server, since this is for, after all, new scripters, who may not know this. I didn't know it, either

True, but for now I think it would be enough for just have a quick guide to read "Here is how to stop people from messing up your stuff" plus whoever messes with other people's stuff is thrown out.

It's a lot more attainable goal to at least get it going and then say "Stefan, 100 people are using this server let's make it more custom"

[DustyPorViva]

When I had the Developers Circle I made a list of rules and tips for people. Such as telling them to back-up data as frequently as possible. I let them clearly know they were responsible for their stuff, not me. So on and so forth. So in case anyone ever deleted crap, or the server was taken back, they would have a back-up.

Just let people know their stuff is in their own hands, and **** happens... if they can't accept that then too bad.

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by HoudiniMan

True, but for now I think it would be enough for just have a quick guide to read "Here is how to stop people from messing up your stuff" plus whoever messes with other people's stuff is thrown out.

It would teach scripters something if you gave them a guide explaining how to protect your scripts as well. Where as if we simply disabled it they wouldn't learn that.

[cbk1994]

Originally Posted by Tigairius

It would teach scripters something if you gave them a guide explaining how to protect your scripts as well. Where as if we simply disabled it they wouldn't learn that.

It would seem best to disable it, and provide a guide, no?

[LoneAngelIbesu]

Originally Posted by cbk1994

It would seem best to disable it, and provide a guide, no?

Providing a guide is more practical, and likely, though.

I think, with proposals like these, the less work that Stefan has to do, the better the chances of the proposal being accepted.

[thatdwarf]

I agree with this idea.

This also gives scripters who are more familiar with the new implimentation an opportunity to expand their knowledge on different subjects they may be clueless or weak on without having to worry about damaging a public server, or if they arent employed on any playerworld.

And like Houdini said, you'd be responsible for your own work if some kind of security is not added to the server.

Then again, only a fool would screw around with an opportunity like this

[cbk1994]

Originally Posted by thatdwarf

Then again, only a fool would screw around with an opportunity like this

Or perhaps they want to ruin it for others. There are certain groups that would certainly try to abuse this.

[DustyPorViva]

Originally Posted by cbk1994

Or perhaps they want to ruin it for others. There are certain groups that would certainly try to abuse this.

This is why it's best to take things into your own hands. Much like theft in real-life.

Sure, it sucks that people can, and will go breaking into cars and steal yours... and it sucks that the police will most likely not be able to do something. But at the end of the day, perhaps the best thing you can do is have an alarm and other safety features installed, to protect your stuff by yourself.

Graal, just like life, will never be 100[percent] fullproof, and even if that was implemented, and even if they took all the measures they can to protect you and your scripts... it's best just to take things into your own hands.

[TESTRETIS]

#gscript revival much?

[napo_p2p]

Originally Posted by TESTRETIS

#gscript revival much?

It seems a lot like it, although on a bigger scale.

[xXziroXx]

The server would have to be enabled for Classic accounts as well though, or the whole purpose of it would be gone.

[Pelikano]

God -.-
After:

Originally Posted by HoudiniMan

When I had the idea I did think of a lot of reasons this wouldn't work.

Abusing it is the biggest one we would have to deal with...

But for now let's just DO IT. We can find trustworthy people to manage it and if somebody abuses their access we remove it.

Let's just do it and get some momentum.

NOW!

I thought now you guys are really going to do something.
But it seems like you want to talk for another month and then forget everything again.. -.-

[DustyPorViva]

Originally Posted by Pelikano

God -.-
After:


I thought now you guys are really going to do something.
But it seems like you want to talk for another month and then forget everything again.. -.-

The hell are you talking about? This thread isn't even a day old, these kind of things don't happen overnight.

[Pelikano]

They should.

[HoudiniMan]

We have a server!

Our sincere thanks to Clockwork for the use of his rented space for this project!

For now I have renamed the server to Testbed Server.

We've moving now fellas, next on my list is to get classic accounts enabled.
Don't expect any ironic timing posts on this one, it will probably take a while.

[Soala]

Where did Wartime (Aeko's playerworld) go ?

[Codein]

Originally Posted by alexandralove

Where did Wartime (Aeko's playerworld) go ?

That's what I was thinking.

[Clockwork]

I got a job that will take all day, 6 days a week, and no one was really working on wartime do to lack of a NAT capable of working on the 2 bigger projects we needed.. :P

Anyways, I have another server, I can just upload my backup there and continue to work on it a little everyday.

[Soala]

Tell us the name please =D

[Clockwork]

Originally Posted by alexandralove

Tell us the name please =D

Lol, Land of the swine.

[Soala]

It's yours o_O ? I didn't know.

[Chompy]

Originally Posted by alexandralove

It's yours o_O ? I didn't know.

Uhm, Caleb/Mursle owns that server.. :o

[DarkReaper0]

How are you going to manage to get every person who logs onto that server RC access anyway?

[Tigairius]

I've been working setting up the systems to control the test server, once the core scripting is set up it should be ready to add people. Right now it supports protecting default filenames from being uploaded on to the server (like sprites.png, etc) and is almost ready to support NC-Weapon protection (so people can't add your personal NPCs to themselves).

Assuming everything goes well today, between GK and this server (at the moment) it should be about ready by this evening.

Originally Posted by DarkReaper0

How are you going to manage to get every person who logs onto that server RC access anyway?

At first you will have to simply submit an application by logging on to the server and filling it out on client (would just desired IP range and any special instructions you have for the directors, not like you'll be disapproved). Once you submit the application it will automatically email it to the 'directors' of the server who will add your RC and rights.

If all goes well with this server the ultimate goal is that it will have a custom GServer with which anyone can log in to RC automatically. We're going to try it this way first to see if it goes over well.

Nobody will be denied access to the server based on their past or present behavior unless they break a rule on the server (finding some bug to massively delete other people's content, for example).