Facebook Graal

[Crono]

Just hit 1337 status.

Recently started playing (on a smurf Facebook account of course).

[Galdor]

[Seeya]

Facebook Graal is horrible.

[Crono]

Originally Posted by Seeya

Facebook Graal is horrible.

Better than Graal on the iPhone and better than Graal on PC if you're looking for a "real Graal" experience.

I connect to the iPhone server everytime, I just don't understand why this isn't on the normal Graal client...the flash client is a bit "wat".

[Galdor]

Originally Posted by Crono

Better than Graal on the iPhone and better than Graal on PC if you're looking for a "real Graal" experience.

Just because it has more players right? I doubt the content is that epic :P

[Crono]

Originally Posted by Galdor

Just because it has more players right? I doubt the content is that epic :P

A "real" Graal server has no content, it's just pking/spar/chat. Sure servers forced themselves to have quests but I never considered that a part of gameplay. More of an obstacle. Despite what people say, quests were generally not fun at all and was a chore for new players.

[Galdor]

Originally Posted by Crono

A "real" Graal server has no content, it's just pking/spar/chat. Sure servers forced themselves to have quests but I never considered that a part of gameplay. More of an obstacle. Despite what people say, quests were generally not fun at all and was a chore for new players.

Well I guess I can relate, I used to love just that with the game Rune, it had an awesome combat system (expect for the abusive and overpowered jump swing) like parrying, blocking and you could even throw your weapon.
Graal on the other hand has to me always been about questing and exploring (just like zelda) and I would get extremely bored after a while with a server that just relied on pking/sparring.

[ffcmike]

Originally Posted by Crono

A "real" Graal server has no content, it's just pking/spar/chat. Sure servers forced themselves to have quests but I never considered that a part of gameplay. More of an obstacle. Despite what people say, quests were generally not fun at all and was a chore for new players.

Who's to say what a real Graal experience is when servers are occupying different specific niches?

When it comes to pking/spar/chat these are things offered by virtually every established Graal server that has ever existed. These are part of each server but they are not what makes a server what it is....
Under that logic you might aswell say a real Graal server is a server that allows you to customise your appearance and upload graphics.

I can only really vouch for what I believe is a "Classic" Graal experience, and again I understand that people do have varying ideas on this that depend on what their own experiences were based upon, which is nothing unexpected.
Applying this principle however, it was the questing which set the server apart.
Even throughout the more simplistic times before Tyhm revolutionised Classic it was still predominantly a questing game.

Has anyone ever considered why Graal is called Graal?
Graal is a French derivative of the word Grail, as in Holy Grail.
The main purpose behind the game was to find the 4 Graals and open the Golden Gate..... kindof like Zelda.
You cannot deny the Zelda aspect has attracted many people to this game.

[Tricxta]

Its better then iPhone classic though... swamp town is looking good kudos too whoever did the weather effect

[fowlplay4]

The whole VIP thing doesn't seem to be helping out the Facebook server too much.

[Tricxta]

Originally Posted by fowlplay4

The whole VIP thing doesn't seem to be helping out the Facebook server too much.

Well being able to use your ipod account sure beats having to start from scratch lol. I just don't think many people have the dedication to get 7500 gralats each month. I know I don't lol hence I don't play facebook graal much.

[0PiX0]

Originally Posted by Seeya

Facebook Graal is horrible.

It has potential, and much like iPhone, it has room for improvement and expansion.

Originally Posted by Stefan

We will need the new server infrastructure to be to handle the higher playercount brought by the Web/Facebook version

It's great that the Facebook server has the capability for a high playercount at least.
Currently, iPhone players are the majority of the Facebook Graal playercount. Since iPhone players do not have much incentive to play a clone if iClassic on Facebook, other playerworlds should be given the opportunity to move to Facebook.

Originally Posted by unixmad

We are planning to give the opportunity to PlayerWorld owners to move to Free To Play either. We will soon give a list of requirements to move a server Free To Play.

5 months later...
Really, the requirements should have been posted before Facebook Graal was even released. The oh-so-dedicated Graal development community could have been preparing whatever server content is necessary for moving to Facebook (or iPhone). We really should have more details than this:

Originally Posted by unixmad

Free to Play is possible when server and content have been transformed to bring revenues with items and features.

Graal Classic/Era Iphone servers have been transformed to fit Free to Play.

So before switching to free to play, servers will have to introduce Pay items/heads or features.

It would also be nice if GraalOnline began attracting a larger playerbase through means other than word-of-mouth and a handful of review web pages.

Originally Posted by fowlplay4

The whole VIP thing doesn't seem to be helping out the Facebook server too much.

I don't see any reason for iPhone players to buy into it, except for the promised monthly VIP item. Even that isn't a good reason. The iPhone server is populated, so why would players want to pay for VIP just to switch to the Facebook server? The VIP system could use some revision.

[gaben]

I don't think iPod Grawl or Facebook Grawl are horrible by any means, but I must say that they definitely have an impact on the playercount of 'regular' Grawl (ie. on the PC). Most players whom have heard of Grawl, would prefer their iPod Grawl/'Facebook' Grawl over the PC version of Grawl. At the end of the day though, the point that I'm trying to make is that regardless of which one is better PC Grawl will eventually fade from the picture if this love of iPod/Facebook Grawl keeps up.

Though, I must say that Facebook Grawl looks lamer than iPod Grawl.

Also, I realize that the creators behind Facebook Grawl definitely don't care about the playercount of PC Grawl, all they care about is the fact that their €s are incrementing. No point crying over spilt milk though, this was inevitable in some ways. iPod Grawl was only the first step. One must accept that Grawl, like many things, has become a business and in this day and age time will tell.

Who knows? Soon you might be sulking around in the latest Grawl merch and purchasing head777.png mugs!


EDIT: I didn't realize they connected the Facebook servers with the iPod servers. I guess they're just trying to market more, and not expand more servers. Phew - you're saved for now..

[NicoX]

Why the hell you are saying Grawl? It makes me crazy reading Grawl six times !

[gaben]

Originally Posted by NicoX

Why the hell you are saying Grawl? It makes me crazy reading Grawl six times !

I guess whenever the word 'Graal' comes into my mind, I can only mock the term for what it has become. It literally, has lost all meaning to me. Grawl is, well, Grawl!

[NicoX]

Pft....

[Emera]

I think that the facebook tileset should be used for iClassic. It is much nicer.

[callimuc]

Originally Posted by Emera

I think that the facebook tileset should be used for iClassic. It is much nicer.

I think Stefan & CO just wants people to buy VIP at least once, because its way nicer (tileset, ...). They want to get people on VIP server but kind of fail at it. I don´t think they will add it to the iClassic.

[Crono]

By real I meant the generic default Graal servers we had that made up the majority of the playerlist in the early 2000's (basically up until around 2004).

[ffcmike]

Originally Posted by Crono

By real I meant the generic default Graal servers we had that made up the majority of the playerlist in the early 2000's (basically up until around 2004).

I think you're confusing the word "real" with "core".
It's true that many of these early servers shared the same core elements under their more basic form compared to what we see today, but this wasn't the result of something intentional. This was largely down to Graal's development capabilities being more limited, and perhaps partly because of Graal being more open for any player to submit their own content.

I also don't believe questing was held in low regard by the majority, many of these servers did implement their own forms of it.

[Crono]

Perhaps I consider "core" to be the "real" Graal. The majority of our gameplay time was spent chatting and pking/sparring with the default system. iClassic provides this experience, to an extent anyway.

If anyone gave a rat's ass about questing Shaded Legends would have been a hit. Instead, despite questing content on a scale higher than anything else provided, it flopped.

[ffcmike]

Originally Posted by Crono

The majority of our gameplay time was spent chatting and pking/sparring with the default system.

Isn't this how it is on most multiplayer online games, and virtually all Graal servers except with different combat systems?
This is really just the inevitability of end-game or there being no other forms of solid content to occupy yourself.

History shows that as servers increase in numbers, the effects of these core elements sustaining a large playercount wear off.
This isn't purely because of competition though, this is because these forms of gameplay are simply a reflection of community interaction, and what iPhone does show is that playercount attracts playercount.
The exact same effect can be and probably would have been achieved on iPhone regardless of how the default combat system works, and regardless of the amount of solid content at hand.

[Crono]

Have you ever played a server outside of Classic?

Originally Posted by ffcmike

History shows that as servers increase in numbers, the effects of these core elements sustaining a large playercount wear off.

No, history does not show us this. Despite Graal's slow decay UN held onto its playercount and had an active pking and sparring community. Zodiac's core gameplay is the only thing sustaining the server.

Originally Posted by ffcmike

The exact same effect can be and probably would have been achieved on iPhone regardless of how the default combat system works, and regardless of the amount of solid content at hand.

Check out the playercount when the GST starts.

[ffcmike]

Originally Posted by Crono

Have you ever played a server outside of Classic?

What does it matter?
Does not attempting to play elsewhere mean it's unjustifiable for me to use observations of other servers playercounts among writings of those that have played them as evidence for an idea?

Originally Posted by Crono

No, history does not show us this. Despite Graal's slow decay UN held onto its playercount and had an active pking and sparring community.

Are you sure?
UNs population has benefited from the demise of Classic, Delteria, Npulse, aswell as an intake of iPhone refugees, and therefore pretty much has a monopoly over default style combat.
Yet for the last year or 2 it has shown a steady decline in numbers. Granted there are many contributing factors to decline of playercount but I still hear the same complaints of "there's not much to do".

I make no secret of my desire for there to be a Zelda style adventure game, but I can also see how such things as sparring/PKing/events etc are an important piece of the overall puzzle when it comes to one server among many succeeding.

Lets say that eventually Kingdoms, Zodiac and Zone were to move onto iPhone, it would be dangerous for iClassic to take these things for granted and rely upon them solely.
These forms of community interaction will be offered by multiple different servers and it's only a minority who will care about what combat system it is.

Anybody saying "nobody cares about quests" and "I spend all of my time sparring and PKing so that's all what matters" is simply being selfish.

Originally Posted by Crono

Zodiac's core gameplay is the only thing sustaining the server.

This kindof backs up my point, Zodiac is out-competing UN in terms of playercount, and has an entirely different combat system to default. It is a reflection of the community it has built up via its unique aspects.

Check out the playercount when the GST starts.

Check out the playercount after any organised server wide event.

[Crono]

Originally Posted by ffcmike

What does it matter?
Does not attempting to play elsewhere mean it's unjustifiable for me to use observations of other servers playercounts among writings of those that have played them as evidence for an idea?

It causes you to draw false conclusions.

Originally Posted by ffcmike

Are you sure?

Yes, I am sure.

Originally Posted by ffcmike

This kindof backs up my point, Zodiac is out-competing UN in terms of playercount, and has an entirely different combat system to default. It is a reflection of the community it has built up via its unique aspects.

There are other factors at work here than just gameplay. Hint: it's not quests.

In the end I think you completely missed the point I was making anyway. My point was that iClassic provides us with that "old" Graal gameplay (call it "core", "real", whatever). Quests are missing but nobody really cares.

[Emera]

WOW you guys calm down. But really Thor have you never played anything but classic?

[jorollychu]

still waiting for android

[NewYorkerNick]

Why can't graal be lyke it wuz?

[DustyPorViva]

Originally Posted by NewYorkerNick

Why can't graal be lyke it wuz?

iPhone/Facebook Graal is a lot like Graal used to be, minus the tons of horrible quests that no one liked doing anyways(they were either always buggy, or just sucked... or both). Graal has always heavily relied on community for enjoyment, and it's pretty much what's being provided(more than it ever has had).

[WanDaMan]

I don't understand why they haven't released the servers for public use on PC as that would bring in more revenue (providing they manage to integrate the purchasing for upgrades via PC) or alternatively make them Gold servers.

[PhantosP2P]

My guesses:

A) They haven't set up their business model to allow for it yet, i.e. they haven't adjusted the microtransactions of FB graal to work with PC graal; FB Credits don't translate as easily over to the PC graal's payment scheme. It would almost immediately make the PC version's business model look outrageous.

B) They don't believe their server(s) could handle the extra 100-200 or so players. This is a weak guess.

C) They haven't configured the game to work smoothly across both platforms, or feel as if PC graal connecting to FB graal gives the former an unfair advantage in terms of playability. I've tried both and I feel as if PC graal is a smoother experience, enough to say that a sparring match would go to the PC gamer if it became a duel of the pings, etc.

[Sword]

Can someone explain why files (heads, swords, etc.) are no longer cached by Flash anymore? Do you know how inconvenient and laggy it is to reload EVERY single graphic and file every time I reconnect? Isn't that a stress on your bandwidth, as well?