Where do the rights to head/bodies lay?

12171217 · #1 12-19-2009, 05:36 AM

I mean, many of them are not created by Cyberjourers, they're created by the players. Where are rights held? If they were to be used in other projects, would it be a violation of some copyright?

cbk1994 · #2 12-19-2009, 06:07 AM

They probably belong to CJ by the "if you upload it, it's ours" policy.

Loriel · #3 12-19-2009, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12171217

If they were to be used in other projects, would it be a violation of some copyright?

By you? Definitely.

Imperialistic · #4 12-19-2009, 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loriel

By you? Definitely.

LOL irl

Dnegel · #5 12-19-2009, 05:09 PM

Zelda a Link to the Past, the noob body is like Link's body in the game. And the head is about 70 % like Link's head, only the hat is missing.

12171217 · #6 12-19-2009, 05:46 PM

So if I were to upload a copyrighted head, it's no longer my problem, but Cyberjourers? At least by the "if you upload it it's ours" policy, heh.

Elk · #7 12-19-2009, 06:19 PM

It would be your problem, because you would have infringed against the copyright

fowlplay4 · #8 12-19-2009, 06:48 PM

Since we're talking about rights.

Note that anything uploaded onto a server, becomes that server's property too, even if it's never used. Which is pretty ridiculous.

DustyPorViva · #9 12-19-2009, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fowlplay4

Since we're talking about rights.

Note that anything uploaded onto a server, becomes that server's property too, even if it's never used. Which is pretty ridiculous.

Why? Don't work on a server if you don't intend for your stuff to belong to them. Without such precaution anyone could just quit and take all their work with them(for servers like Zodiac and Era, this could cripple the server depending on what the person made).

I've made plenty of things for servers that never saw the light of day, and while it's depressing... oh well.

12171217 · #10 12-19-2009, 07:16 PM

If this applies to Testbed, then several servers that tested their scripts on Testbed first could be screwed if anyone actually gave a ****.

DustyPorViva · #11 12-19-2009, 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12171217

If this applies to Testbed, then several servers that tested their scripts on Testbed first could be screwed if anyone actually gave a ****.

I'm pretty sure it doesn't :P

fowlplay4 · #12 12-19-2009, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DustyPorViva

Why? Don't work on a server if you don't intend for your stuff to belong to them. Without such precaution anyone could just quit and take all their work with them(for servers like Zodiac and Era, this could cripple the server depending on what the person made).

Which is exactly what happened lol, but the graphics weren't crippling at all to said server (in fact they need to worry about other things) and it was only really done to spite our new GAT members, and that server hasn't been using their graphics for months so to play the ownership card like that is pretty lame.

Darklux · #13 12-19-2009, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbk1994

They probably belong to CJ by the "if you upload it, it's ours" policy.

Probaply! The usage conditions are probaply null and void - due to this passage - as you don't grant usage rights but give away your property.
And code of conducts mustn't be contradictory to valid law, but as long as noone puts them in question (in terms of a lawsuit, and I highly doubt anybody would start one), they are valid for graal.

But even if the right to gfx would be on the player side, would be hard to find copyright owners. There are so many slight modifications and recolors out.

=> It's CJ's!

Elk · #14 12-19-2009, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fowlplay4

Since we're talking about rights.

Note that anything uploaded onto a server, becomes that server's property too, even if it's never used. Which is pretty ridiculous.

It's easy to break that copyright if Stefan thinks that it's a good decision for the specific image to be on another server fitting better

Darklux · #15 12-19-2009, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elk

It's easy to break that copyright if Stefan thinks that it's a good decision for the specific image to be on another server fitting better

I think there are mainly other reasons behind these rules. It's about CJ having the right to digitally distribute the content at all, if they wouldn't have the rights or atleast usage rights, it could be illegal to let players on that content.
Afaik, most big online platforms have these kind of rules.

Loriel · #16 12-19-2009, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elk

It's easy to break that copyright if Stefan thinks that it's a good decision for the specific image to be on another server fitting better

That is because what you quoted was utterly wrong, the legal rights go to Graal and Graal usually lets the specific server it was made for use it, or possibly other servers. Copyright is with Graal itself in all cases and is not broken or whatever.

xXziroXx · #17 12-19-2009, 10:01 PM

Stefan said himself that the "anything you upload becomes property of CJ" was more of a safety precaution towards the company as a whole rather then the actual truth. Something we found out when Oinkness was hesitant about uploading his songs for Mythic since he didn't want CJ claiming the rights for it. At most you might see CJ using an image for another of their games, but not without trying to contact the original author first (if it's known who it is).

Mark Sir Link · #18 12-20-2009, 12:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loriel

That is because what you quoted was utterly wrong, the legal rights go to Graal and Graal usually lets the specific server it was made for use it, or possibly other servers. Copyright is with Graal itself in all cases and is not broken or whatever.

I don't recall this being in the original Terms of Use I registered for, nor have I seen any conspicuous notice of this when accessing file browser; if CJ is really operating under such policy it seems tantamount to theft.

EDIT: it doesn't seem to be in the current terms of use either, and I'm a bit disturbed that no notices have been made to players about the changes in Terms of Use.

Immolate · #19 12-20-2009, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xXziroXx

Stefan said himself that the "anything you upload becomes property of CJ" was more of a safety precaution towards the company as a whole rather then the actual truth. Something we found out when Oinkness was hesitant about uploading his songs for Mythic since he didn't want CJ claiming the rights for it. At most you might see CJ using an image for another of their games, but not without trying to contact the original author first (if it's known who it is).

This seems the most plausible.

Loriel · #20 12-20-2009, 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Sir Link

EDIT: it doesn't seem to be in the current terms of use either, and I'm a bit disturbed that no notices have been made to players about the changes in Terms of Use.

Yeah, I figure they just removed it at some point when they got tired of arguing about it with players. Expecting lawyer-proof legal positions is maybe a bit much.

I do not think it is theft because it simply does not happen if you do not more or less explicitly agree with it, it is not like there is some sort of office of copyright that they are going to inform that they have now acquired all your precious little music files.

Mark Sir Link · #21 12-20-2009, 03:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loriel

Yeah, I figure they just removed it at some point when they got tired of arguing about it with players. Expecting lawyer-proof legal positions is maybe a bit much.

I do not think it is theft because it simply does not happen if you do not more or less explicitly agree with it, it is not like there is some sort of office of copyright that they are going to inform that they have now acquired all your precious little music files.

a disclaimer added to RC would be nice because as far as I can tell, the only thing that states that CJ owns all property uploaded is the occasional forum post that ends up unseen by 90 per cent (LOL) of people developing on Graal.

These forum posts also do not reference ToU so it would be nice to see
A.) an update to the ToU
B.) an actual notification of update to the ToU

Loriel · #22 12-20-2009, 03:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Sir Link

a disclaimer added to RC would be nice because as far as I can tell, the only thing that states that CJ owns all property uploaded is the occasional forum post that ends up unseen by 90 per cent (LOL) of people developing on Graal.

I think it is worth stating more clearly that, in my opinion as someone who is not a lawyer or anything close to that, CJ does not automatically own uploaded content. In contrary, the requirement for uploading content is assigning copyright to CJ. If you upload content without doing that, you are in violation with the TOC and your content has to be removed and chances are someone will yell at you at some point. But it does not magically become someone else's property.