Recent Ban
 

Although I'm more then likely to be banned myself, I'm simply going to post about it anyways.

Recently, I acquired some Elven boots+4. I gave them to my irl friend Fenix (fenixthebanished) for him to hold to give to Tseng while I logged off. Fenix has been grounded lately, and only has 1 hour of online time per day. He had already used that time, but was granted another 15 to go on Kingdoms and give the item to Tseng. Tseng had taken about, 5 hours, so it was 9:39 PST(pacific) when the trade happened. The elven boots were given, and in compensation, we got Gloves of Serpentskin. WC+ Dam+ type gloves. With that, he informed us that the damage would be taken off.

Fenix pm'd his buddy list (not too many people on then, maybe 44) and Raelyn wanted to trade for them. Fenix did not mention they would be striped of damage, seeing as too how he really DIDNT have too at all. Raelyn traded his havoks+7 to Fenix, Tseng adding that "So long as Raelyn knows the damage is going to be removed." By then, Fenix's father was telling him to get off, so he lent me the gloves, and logged off, which made him look like a scammer.

Tseng questioned me abit, but I really couldnt do anything. I wasnt allowed to call that late for a petty game, so Tseng decided to go to Testbed and get the materials for new havoks, then he said he was going to alch them somewhere. I really lost intrest at this point, and went about killing lords..

This afternoon however, Fenix logged on, and after a breif pm to pm talk between Fenix and Tseng, Tseng ended by pming me saying my Friend had been banned...

Of course, the reason is for scamming, which is legal unless it's used through a glitch in the table, so I now wonder, why werent the 1 person who scammed me of dual rows, havok gloves, and sun shield , banned when they even SAID they scammed me.

But, the funniest part, is that the reason for being banned (when you try to log onto the account name) is "Reason: Stealing an event item from and admin then trading it", which is quite incorrect. He was GIVEN the item to trade with or keep. He decided to trade with it, even if he didnt give all of the information about the item.

I ask he is unbanned, and possibly this situation looked into further. I do warn you, the parents of Fenix are seeking a lawful way too solve this If i dont.

Re: Recent Ban
 

wtf =/

Re: Re: Recent Ban
 

they have that right ;x

Re: Re: Re: Recent Ban
 

:o How long's he banned for arg didly argo

Re: Re: Re: Re: Recent Ban
 

Im unsure. I, do however know, this WILL be resolved.

Mm... Now I know Tseng was going to give Rae those gloves

Assassin Raelyn Cump (Crescent Pirates) (11/10/2003 7:13:06 PM):
Perfect Havoks are going to be super nice. *smiles*

If you think it's fake, check his own logs.

I believe you guys are in the wrong, if an admin gives you an event item and tells you the stats are about to be altered then trading it without informing the person on the recieving end is only greed and dishonest. It isn't only scamming but abusing a priviledge, an admin's trust and causing an even larger conflict than started off with. Tseng is only helping, why don't you think of how the situation were to turn out if you guys weren't such bloody idiots? Like I've said before you shouldn't even be compensated for those items either.

Can you ban somebody for them for scamming? No. Abusing a priviledge? It's obvious that that isnt in the rules either. Breaking an admins trust? Oh no? You cant ban for any of these reasons. Stack them atop eachother, you still cant. He changed the ****ing reason of the ban in the ban window you get when logging on, which means HE's being dishonest. :/ Stay out of this.

Re: Recent Ban
 

Accurate enough.

You're missing several details. I shall explain in the latter part of this post.

How you were scammed is irrelevant to this case, buddy. Sorry, but the world doesn't revolve around you.

He essentially stole it from me.

Latter part of this post -> explanation of why he shall not be unbanned.

Awesome. Should I post my name, address, and phone#, because i would love to see the lawsuit. Not only would his family's "lawyers" laugh at you, but (assuming someone'd be stupid enough to take the case) the judge laughing at you as well. See, there's this idea of a contract - when you sign it, you agree to its terms, and...oh, lookie here:

In other words, you cannot hold Cyberjoueur liable for anything I do, and I have the right to determine what is or is not acceptable. Thus, by the contract which you signed, you cannot take legal action against Linux Cyberjoueur or against myself as a Graalonline Administrator.

And now, friend Argosax, since you seem intent on promoting your friend's stupidity, I shall explain to you in rather great detail just what happened.

I gave him a warning. I made it quite clear that it could only be traded so long as the other party knew of the future reduction of the gloves' statistics. He violated that warning and traded it - he, himself, admits this. However, during our PM conversation, he made no steps to rectify the situation. Instead, he pathetically tried to explain away what he did, assign fault to myself, to Raelyn (the person he scammed), or to a random administrator who allowed Argosax to be scammed in the past (again, the fact that Argosax was scammed before is irrelevant).

Now, once he admitted to scamming it (which is, by the way, a violation of the Graalonline code of conduct), the next logical thing is to attempt to solve it. The previous night, I'd attempted to recreate the scammed item (a set of Havok gloves) to replace the one that Fenix (Argo's friend) scammed. To me, this seemed the simplest way to rectify the situation - no punishments would have to be dealt, and everyone would be happy with the items they got. Unfortunately, when creating it, it lacked a speed+1, which is a rather important facet of the Havok gloves item. So, I was unable to give a good replacement for the one he'd lost. This brought me into the negotiations with Fenix - however, Fenix repeatedly would not listen to me, attempt to explain it away, attempt to give excuses, attempt to change the subject, etc.

I was finally making some progress, when Argosax idiotically massed about the situation, whining about his own experiences being scammed, and how it's unfair that I'd try to enforce a rule like that. Sorry, Argo, but two wrongs don't make a right. Regardless - from that message of Argo's, Fenix's beliefs that he had no reason to cooperate were reinforced, and he brazenly told me that he wouldn't do a damn thing. It was then crystal clear to me that he would not cooperate at all, and he was banned. As far as I'm concerned, he took something without permission and traded it without permission. This amounts to a violation on several levels of what's considered to be acceptable behavior.

To summarize:

No.

I PM'd Tseng in-game... this doesnt need to be a open dispute or w/e the fux it is...

I would like to say this, I myself didnt see the warning, and likewise, the speed+1 was not on my pair or havoks I received when I turned in my bandits... I must dis-agree with the speed being a big part of those gloves, but. There isnt anything I can do...

What this basicaly means is that I could pay for an account, then a global admin could globaly ban me for no reason whatsoever when I logged on?
That really doesn't make any sense :/
Or a global admin with access to accounts could just get my CC numbers, address, real name, email, and LINUX Cyberjoueurs wouldn't have to face any sort of punishment by law?

Even if all that were true: If you don't like it, why did you agree to the contract?

Er, to him or me.. if too me

Cuz I had no other way of playing graal if i didnt accept, DUH

If your talking to me..
I agreed to it mainly because I never expected this topic to come up, to be honost. You have to agree to things like this on everything you sign up for, you don't exactly expect these types of issues to come up every time.
It's not like I really mind anyways, since I doubt that any of that would happen.

I am. I thought the context made that obvious.

Then, when it does, you have no right to complain.

By living in this country, I am agreeing to pay the taxes the government asks. That in no way means that I don't have the right to complain about them.

Okay. No grounds for complaint.

lol, when you post it on the forums (which isnt allowed to begin with) it is an open discussion ;)

Sounds to me like your friend was given every opportunity to do the right thing, and he refused? If so, he was basically asking to be banned in accordance to graalonline rules

Damn woman, **** already. It was put in Forums for a good reason, it was taken out for another. Just mind your damnd buisness and go the **** away k?

If an Admin says something, it is for a reason, and if you don't listen, he can lock you out of the playerworld without even giving you a reason. I just think that just mabey if Lance finds the heart to, give this kid a break. No one reads that contract you bind yourself too when you make an account. I know most of you didn't, though you say you do. Just take the item, and unban him. GK is getting reset or whatever soon anyway, right?

If you have bothered to read the Forum rules as well you would have seen that there are proper steps for complaints and the Forum isn't one of them, plus the fact you openly "threaten the Game with a lawsuit" if you don't get your way? The cost of a International lawsuit would be huge so your threats are minuscule at best, plus as someone already stated Graal is well within their rights do make such an action. So as in life bite the bullet and move on, you are fighting a losing battle. :\

How did he get the Elven Boots + 4 or whatever they were in the first place....?

Elven Boots +4 yus...

We traded somebody for them ;o Not gonna involve them in this, since the source of the boots doesnt need to get in trouble.

If you post this in public forums, your going to have to expect words from people other then who your expecting. That is what private messages are for.

So technically, your making this everyones business by posting it on the open forums.

There is really no reason to cuss me, and get hysterical :\

Look, these are PUBLIC forums...I was trying to point out to this guy that, one he isnt suppose to post that stuff here, two, what his friend did was wrong anyway. If someone doesnt seem to know the rules, I will tell them.....dont like it? Tuff

If you would stop pretending to be a forum mod, then you wouldn't have so many people that dislike you.

If you people would use some common sense, then there wouldn't be a need to be "pretending to be a forum mod".

There is no need to pretend to be a forum mod at all, seeing that there are actually moderators and all.

owned water :(

Argo, sorry but I agree with what they're saying...Your friends should of tooken what Lance offered, he didn't have to give him anything. :(

*Sigh* Why must I keep explaining this? I am not pretending to be a mod, I simply try to inform people when they do something wrong (since the rules are hard to find), to keep them from getting into further trouble...I dont see anything wrong with that :\

You're in the right, Moon Goddess. You pointed out the obvious contradiction between creating this thread in a public forum and stating that this should not be a public matter.

I do find it humorous that people are willing to make things public matters as long as they think they're in the right, but the instant they're wrong, it becomes "Oops, sorry, let's not have this publicly known."

As for moderation - Kai's pretty darn good. The Graal2002 forums could use a bit more moderation though, I suppose. I'll ask Stefan what he thinks.

Agreed. I don't read them much, since I don't play GK. That said, however, people can very easily report problems to me when they find them. Certain peoples usually seem more interested in flaming the offender than rectifying the issue...

Kai, when we use that spify little link to "report this post to a moderator," do you read them?

They drop straight into my inbox, so yeah. What, you think I'd just delete them? Don't let your dislike of me delude you into thinking I don't take my job seriously.

Of course, this is assuming the forum emailer is working at the moment. I haven't received anything for a while, perhaps it died again.

x_X Waterlord jus re-directed me to this thread... That flame towards Moon wasnt me just so you know. :o Im not that disrespectful x.x It was a irl friend over at my house while I was showering ;o I came down and he said he was "reading" the posts and "responding" to some of the pm's he was getting. Didnt think he'd post, so, sorry! x-x

Yes, this has been taken to Graal pm, but I put it on the forums for a reason, Tseng ignores me (most of the time he's busy) in-game, so I didnt wanna waste my time pming him to no response...

Sorry about what he said, I'm gonna start logging out now x.x

Obviously there are moderators. Has it occurred to you that they aren't only pouring over ever little dainty detail at every moment? It's called being a good samaritan, per say.
There's no sense sitting by and always waiting for a moderator to deal with things. Then again, if people could use common sense and follow very allowing rules, then this shouldn't be a problem, should it?

Sorry to burst your bubble, but it doesn't work like that.

If so, then that's only because some people don't stick with the rules in one way or another.