Well said Door, I couldn't agree with you more.

[rep ++;]

Yeah, but "you can't always get what you want" would work better in this situation..

That makes alot of sense. Anyway trials do recieve less punishment. Lets say when a trial is jailed on every server except UN they can not get out of jailed. Also if they get banned who cares they can make another account no big deal.

Well.... :blush:

I wouldn't say that, I've seen some trials that talked so seriously and knew what they were doing (even helped me) that I had to look 3 times in their profile before I believed they weren't p2p.

trials suk olol

didn't take much of a dare to say that.

So?

It's called special ed. It happens, as unfortunate as it is.

Your analogy sucks. Also, no one is saying that we should send them off and such. We just stereotype them as idiots because thats how a lot of them present themselves.

im impresiv i kno...

Refer to 2 points up.

No, I don't think this is the general attitude.

Only in your own little world.

Yes I said most though. Some trials are loyal to graal but parents may not let them buy p2p or can not supply a way to send the money. They also may have been classic or gold but not lifetime classic. Though I have met one trial who was so loyal to UN she would like make 40 ep a day for a different prize...it was sad to see her say she quit graal because her parents will never let her get p2p :cry: she use to give me free ep *sniff* I miss those ep

Thanks for proving my point. You may as well be sending them off when you treat them like that.

Eh, the thing that makes people play graal is to prove to other people they are better on a virtual game than they are. *Ahem* So we are actually bringing more players to graal. I will accept your silence as a thank you letter. Oh and back on topic, no this forum should not be public. Think about all the people on the internet that probably dislike graal. Open forum equal open opinions.

I proved nothing. Your school analogy was aweful to begin with so I'm not really calling trials retarded. The "trials suk" comment was there to show you that it doesn't take much of a dare to insult a group of people.

And finally I actually play Graal servers and don't sit on classic all day. I've gained enough experience to safely say that I've seen a good amount of idiotic trials to stereotype them as being brainless. I'm not saying they all are dumb, and im not saying that they're dumber than everyone on Graal.

Yeah, except I don't treate them like that.

Go to Unholy Nation :] you will see a trial asking how to get more "yin yangs"

Graal needs more players!

People are complaining that, oh, graal needs to advertise, it needs more players to join, it needs more people to play.

Well maybe if you stopped TREATING THE TRIALS LIKE TOTAL **** they would want to upgrade!

Once upon a time, I was a trial! And so was everyone else here. We all put up with people who thought we were idiots and sucked, and made it where we are now.

People need to stop treating the trials like they are nothing. Personally, I think trials should have their own world that ONLY they can go on, which shows them a variety of things. They could be able to save for, say, 15 days, which gives them enough time to figure everything out. After 15 days, they lose everything, and can no longer save.

This way we won't have certain people *cough justabouteveryoneinthisthread cough* who will discourage them from playing! Trials get on UN, where people are running around and people laugh at them for being trials, they get on Classic, where everyone idles and doesn't respond to trials, they get on Era, oh, my! Scamming is now legal!

It's no wonder we get so many new players!

What's stopping them from making more accounts for the 15 day of free p2p? Oh and like some staff on some server said. "We help make the game you are just the cute face that when your number is added on the log in screen people want to log in to our server, so either shut up and play or log out I have no time for your whining" I am pretty sure that was Yen or some staff from Era..sounds like Yen to me.

Okay.. so you claim that the bulk of them are idiots, and you don't even try to hide the fact that it's a stereotype, yet you don't treat them like they're all idiots? Then what do you treat them like, and why does that treatment apply only to them in person? Honestly, I don't even necessarily think that they should have posting rights on the forums, but that doesn't mean that I'm going to be rude like that. I think it's totally uncalled for to talk badly about anyone, especially making generalizations like that. And not that I want to question your psychology, but have you ever thought that maybe you've just encountered more idiot trials, and that the non idiot ones are too busy figuring things out for themselves to bother you? Maybe you think they're mostly idiots because you don't notice the 'smart' ones as much, not because there are less.

And okay, so you yourself don't treat them like they're idiots? Great, so you're reserved enough to treat them as individuals--when they are there to speak up for themselves if you do not--but what about the others who are reading this thread? I mean, come on, you're Crono. You're a hero to many! You teach noobs cliffing like it's going out of style! And you're a bad role model to people who haven't had the chance to get their own impression of 'trials.' If I came here with no prior experience with trials, I'd be fairly easily impressed upon, reading posts calling them idiots and too stupid and distracting to post on the forums. And maybe you're spreading that attitude, the one that's helping to lower player count just a tad more.

Door are you a hippy? Do you think everyone deserve everything? Do you believe to give someone something without them earning it? Unless a trial say something so intelligent about graal that it actually help let say advance players without about 300+ hours on a serve then they are consider an idiot. Oh wait you can also prove to me that you are not an idiot by sending 39 dollars and 99 cent to graalonline for life time classic. Oh and Door how many trials come on classic? That did not have classic before.

I don't think the "how dare you" was supposed to take in a literal sense, more so, "how can you" with little reasoning other then a stereotype opinion, because that's exactly what it is.

If trials are the future profit for Graal, surely they shouldn't be brushed aside, especially when the old is wearing thin.

Lol, analogies..

How many trials do you actually speak to Crono? On average, per week or so?

Not quite sure that you are referring to, but I don't think it's another analogy theory, so I'll go with "It happens, as unfortunate as it is."

With this kind of attitude, I don't understand how anyone can say that "Graal sucks" it's just baffling, especially when most of the complaints are that there's not many players, not much content and you can't deny you haven't said that, weather it be to me or posted somewhere.


Actually it is, it's just an exaggerated version. How many people these days, especially the older members actually play with the newer, fresher members? I know of.. one.

Oh, you complete rebel.

I play Classic and I've been around too. Most of the new members do have a excitable attitude, I wouldn't call them idiots, but weren't we like that too? I know I was.


Yeah, except I don't treate them like that.[/QUOTE]

Before we start I'd like to say that big paragraphs aren't going to help your argument. :mad:

Correct, Correct, Semi-Correct (refer to below).

I PK them more than I PK classic accounts because they are easy picks. I basically exploit their lack of skill. Other times you have an occassional n00blet who has too big of a mouth. I don't think anyone here would take crap from a lil trial, and it sure doesn't leave a good impression for the rest of the trials.

Like what?

How cute.

Refer to my statement about not all trials being dumb.

Wait what? I already explained this.

I'm a bit confused by what you're trying to say here.

A trial has never asked me for LATing help though. And a hero to many? LOL sorry Door, flattering me isn't going to help.

What? I'm not a role model for anyone on Graal.

If they read all my posts they'd understand that not all of them are idiots to begin with. Just a bulk of them, which tend to stand out more than the other smart trials, thus the stereotype.

Oh great, tag teaming?

Ok.



They should fend themselves like we did when we were n00bs.



Excuse my spelling?



You do realize that a large proportion of Zone consists of Trial accounts right? I don't only play classic.



Are you suggesting Graal is dying because we PK n00bs like we always have been for over 7 years?




I play with n00bs on Zone all the time. Hell a lot of the friends I have from Zone only started in 2005 or so.



How is this at all related to what I said?



Like I said before, I don't believe every trial is an idiot, nor do I think the majority are complete retards. It's the bulk that are retarded which stand out the most. Why do you think people have been making fun of UN so much? Because it's full of n00bs, and most trials tend to be n00bs.


Misquote?

Wah wah wah.

Wait, wait are you saying you are a trial or you are a p2p bring trial and if you are a trial you probably do not even know graal have a offical forum. O

Why am I 75% sure you've asked something along these lines before?

How is this relevant AT ALL?

I never ask how to get "yin yangs" infact when I joined graal my friend was a p2p who taught me what everything was, sure I am not the best player and honestly I dont try to be, but as a trial(which i was for about 2 week til i bought my membership over paypal -_-*hint hint for you trials*) I mostly searched around in servers and read masses. Only thing that I remember asking someone that now sounds stupid is "what do p2p stand for"(I didn't read graalonline little help thing)

How was Zid's post...?

I defend the trials justice...
I am the peoples' voice...
I...am...Trialman

I was just stating that while he goes out of his way to consider most/all trials noobs, he probably had the same traits as them at one point

You misinterpreted a lot of what I said... I think you broke it down too much, instead of reading it together, which is how I wrote it, and which is how it should be read. Sorry for not dumbing down my posts by breaking them down sentence by sentence the way you do, but I think paragraphs look better and read in a much more lucid, flowing fashion.

As an FAQ on Classic, I talked to a lot of noobs. Some of them had video problems on their computer and couldn't see the screen problem correctly. Some of them barely spoke English, if they did. I guess all of those are idiots too?

And just to be clear, I didn't mean to say that you're the one tons of people look up to, the cliffing comment was just supposed to be cute. What I mean is that people might read your posts and derive their beliefs from them. It happens. It's very, very easy to impress generalizations on others, and surely if you flaunt this attitude--that the majority of trials are idiots--others will be affected.

How about we do what runescape do to people who arent p2p and call them demos :]

They get a demo of what graal is I am sure that is a better name than trial(Don't care for your argument of why trial is a better name it was a joke get over it)

Um.. Yeah! Crono!

That's nice, because I can't be assed to write out huge paragraphs. Also I prefer breaking down points because it's easier.

I don't know. Were they? You're the one who communicated with them not me.

You totally missed my point. I'm saying that trials are viewed as idiots because theres a lot of them. It's more a stereotype than a truth. But if someone's views are bent because of what I'm posting, that's not my problem.

I don't see how any of you can justify stereotyping trials and PKing them because they are easier to kill! If that is the only way you can get kills, then maybe you should try something else.

Crono, I bet you once were a trial. And I bet anything people made fun of you.

"0Mg Cr0n0 iz pottn sum1 dwn, I m goin 2 b jus lyk him" Just wondering but when you see people post insults or "the truth" do you think trials are thinking this? Honestly who cares the point of this topic is to decide to make this forum public, and I say no. Why let anyone post, why let someone who may be banned from graal post? Why let someone who tried to destroy a server post? You are crying about trials pfft cry for me everytime I honestly get into a server i find out some hackers are trying to destroy it?

Oh and not really my business but of course we were all once trial the thing is even if you got made fun of did you show those people wrong? Most trials i laugh at still make me laugh even if they became a p2p.

They're easier to kill so I'll pk them...

No, I started in 2000 and I was never trial.

Either way when I was a noob I was pked and insulted too, big deal? Who wasn't? It didn't make me quit now did it?

Don't argue against that, it seems pretty silly to say something like "DONT PK THE TRIALS, THEY'RE THE NEW GUYS WE'VE GOT TO BE ALL NICE TO THEM" because PKing is an integral part of the gameplay. I think the tangent that has been brought up, albeit an unprovoked one (or maybe it was? I'm not really following the thread), is the fact of people's attitudes towards trial players, as though they are worthless and they are idiots, which in my opinion is wrong.

In response to the original topic though, I personally don't believe trials should be allowed to post on the forums, and after speaking to Door earlier about it, neither does she. The forums are a part of the game, it also provides an additional feature to upgrading your account. The attitudes towards new players on the forums is horrible too, but that's another conversation altogether.

Until you have spent 25+ hours on zone attempting to chat with the trials there, searching for an intelligent conversation I refuse to take anything you have to say to them into consideration. I have upwards of 1,400 hours on there and I have met some of the most unintelligent people you could ever have nightmares about meeting. Ohgreat, now I can even guess what your thinking. "You were a trial once, don't stereotype them all together!" What punishment can we give them to keep them off the forums if they act like idiots with flaming, spamming and posting pornographic websites? "LOLOL IP BANT!" They can evade that. "LOLOL ACCONT B@N!!!" They can evade that. "LOLOLOL COMPUTER ID BAN!!!!!!111" Guess what... I've heard multiple times that they can, and HAVE been evading that.

For the whole wallowing in your own pile of steaming stupid nonsense... From what I've seen, they don't WANT to change. You can take a horse to water but you can't make it drink. I've tried attempting to educate one with proper grammar and the basics of graal. Wanna guess what response I got 95% of the time? "LOLOL nerd git a lyfe." Some of them may have GREAT ideas, they should just tell those ideas to a P2P in game.

You just broke my heart.. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

Yea, well when you first look at Graal, what do the "hearts" look like to you? It isn't an idiotic question. They just don't know the proper "Graal speak" yet. :\

Lucky for you, you had a friend who knew the ropes to help you, not everyone does.
I applaud trials who aren't afraid to ask questions to get help.
I do not applaud they way they are treated by some staff, and players though. I can't tell you how many complaints I have gotten, and still get about this, in game and on the forums.
I would have to say that this is not a very friendly game at this point.
Years ago, when I first started playing when there was only Classic, the players and staff were much friendlier then today (Not to say there aren't a lot of friendly people, because there are). Seems that for every one decent player, there are two not so decent players. *sigh*

Seriously, let the trials be, let them learn the game without being hated on, and maybe more of them will get p2p's. :mad:

Aww. <3

I didn't, and I had to work my way up from nothing. Didn't stop me though, no matter how many people PKed me and how many people insulted me and stuff.

Hey hey hey, I am helping trials. I help trials learn what happens when you step out of pk zone on era. What happens when you unpause and taunt people. But if they just asked FAQ they would know everything they need to know. Oh and how about having a site for every server explain I already know Un has one. Era is working or been working on one and someone on Zodiac is making one.

Same here, although not as much as trials recieve today. Point is that quite a few have quit, and never returned because of the way they were treated, and nothing was done. Shouldn't be that way. I have seen staff tell trials to "toughen up and learn to take it, or you might as well quit"
This isn't the way to treat potential paying customers.

Hypothesis: They won't read it like most people don't read the CoC or the terms of use when they sign up for a graal account.

Now if you can somehow find a way to ensure these players are over 13 and have a maturity level over 13 then I have no problem whatsoever with them using the forums, but I don't want a bunch of 10 year olds running around here posting "balls" in an interesting topic just for S&G's.

How staff take the time to make a good site and for TRIALS when they log in they will be redirected to the site.(what about the people who do not want to go on the site? Then spend 39 dollars to make sure you never see it anymore)

You had a pretty good post there up until you said this. I have yet to hear a convincing argument explaining just how bashing of trials by older players results in them not subscribing to Graal. From my experiences talking to trials, the number one reason by far cited for not subscribing is inability/unwillingness to use a credit card (despite PayByCash), number two is that they don't like the game content. The only people who seem to blame the community for "rejecting" trials are staff (the people who are supposed to bear most of the responsibility of getting trials to subscribe).