I wasn't PKing Wren and Zoe, they were on peaceful. It was more Craigus because he had stolen a lord kill from me and killed me with magic purposely.



Oh, but wait, isn't this whole thing a "he said she said" or a "he did she did" thing? Yes..

As far as I know she did have me unbanned, yeah, and she was going off of what I said, probably, yes, because:
a.) there were no real screenshots or anything that I had harassed her prior to my being unbanned the first time. I just "had her sandals."
b.) we were in the middle of having someone else banned and she asked if we would just drop everything if she were to have me unbanned because like 23124719 issues popped up.

And she can look into the situation all she want, I believe Angel will be fair. Before you rebanned me locally Wren made a notion to become friends and not worry about it all, I did not answer, and I didn't have time to answer, but I was banned. However, I had Dragon X tell her that I apologized for swinging at her when came up to me, but I told her that I would have no problem leaving them be as it was not my intent to follow them around and torture them. I have much better things to do. Thus, we are at a neutral/friend stage, I assume, but I am banned. The last time I had a message of neutrality, or something of the sort, delivered to Wren, she replied with "get him to talk to me," so I left it at that. (The messenger said that I was banned, etc, but I told him to leave her be.)

You said you would avoid/not PK "dustarians" and that you wouldn't harrass anyone. I believed you could do so - So I gave you that extra chance. Your behavior since has made me regret doing so.

I knew you'd say that - however, the situations are different. I refer to the difference between what someone says their opinion is, and what someone else says their opinion is. I would believe what Zoe said she thought more than I would believe what someone else said Zoe said she thought.

Angel is talking to the people involved, to find out what they themselves believe, instead of what you claim they believe.

I would assume that's why they left Dustari.

Technically they can't be considered Dustarians as they were not in dustari at the time. =x

I asked them to avoid initiating any conflicts with you. I was at the altar at the time, they were just standing there, you came there.

And, i'd like to note that your story has changed - First, you did not PK them, you were not at the altar, then you were at the altar but waiting, and now you admit to PKing them but try to push it off with a technicality? Just how well do you remember it?

And, if you want to get technical, I'd argue that them still wearing Dustari tags (as well as the fact that they retained Dustarian citizenship) would mean that they were, in fact, Dustarians.

this happened over a period of days.

Some times I would be at gov's altar waiting for Lords to come by so I could level, and out of no where tec would start PKing me. Then later Craigus would join in, and then apparently more Dustaris came and decided to PK me.

And there was another time that I was waiting at gov's altar for wren to get done blessing, and lords to come, and Padren starts something out of the blue because I was wearing the same outfit as him.

And, I can walk by Gov's altar. It's not secured by anybody special.


And, uhm, I want to point something out to you. After I was unbanned and I agreed to things, Tecumseh and Craigus and some other Dustarians continued to PK Brad and I when we did not do a thing to Zoe/Wren. We would be in the Trading house and tec would come and start out of nowhere. If this was their part of the agreement, why are they not being punished for breaking it? (note: I did PM Zoe and ask her to request that they leave me alone, and she asked Tec to several times but he did not, so she apologized and would see if there was anything she could do.)

All of the parts of your story i have mentioned were related to the last time, when you felt you were unbanned unfairly.

You being by the altar is important insofar as you said you weren't, but you were - one hole/change in your story is indicative of more.

hold on, I'm confused.
Which ban?

The only time I was PKed at Gov's altar was BEFORE I was unbanned.

After I was unbanned I could go to Gov's and wait for lords and Dustari would leave me alone (sometimes except for when Tec came to the altar and saw me and started to PK me.)

When I gave you the second chance is when I am referring to. You had pked before it, and you had PKed after it. After it, you had claimed to not be there at all, when in fact I personally had witnessed you going there and Pking them. You had claimed that after that second chance, you had not gone there and PKed, and that you weren't there at all. Your story then changed to state that you had gone there peacefully to try to talk to Wren. Since, your story has changed at least one other time, resulting in your current story that you only came there to wait for lords.

uhm, no, actually, I did go to Gov's, but not to bother them.

They saw me there, and I didn't say anything, and they didn't say anything in return. One day when Tec came to the altar, saw me, and started to PK me this is what happened between me and Zoe:

Opposite (8/5/03 4:27:11 PM):

let me know if he does it again

---
You (8/5/03 4:28:37 PM):

He killed me.

---
Opposite (8/5/03 4:28:48 PM):

now????

---
You (8/5/03 4:28:53 PM):

YEs

---
Opposite (8/5/03 4:29:26 PM):

ok.....just hang in there...he is mad because wren left.....I will calm him

----more:
Opposite (8/5/03 4:41:51 PM):

I can't seem to get him to stop......I will keep trying

That was the same day I was banned globally, about an hour or so before. Zoe had offered to GIVE me a prepare weapon scroll because I started to drop diamonds when Tec was PKing me.

You (8/5/03 7:03:22 PM):

How many diamonds for the prepare weapon scroll?

---
Opposite (8/5/03 7:03:41 PM):

do you happen to have an int +3 ring?

---
You (8/5/03 7:04:36 PM):

no.....just int + 2 and RoEs.

---
Opposite (8/5/03 7:05:21 PM):

i'll just give it to you..........i'll be back to main in a little while.......I have to feed
horses


This was the day I was globally banned. I would say we were on pretty neutral terms, no? I mean, I was being sincere to her and TRYING to avoid conflicts with Tec and prevent them via Zoe before they got out of hand.


I can assure you that I put on my friendly face and directed it towards Wren/Zoe after Angel had me unbanned. I only got to play for about an hour and a half before I was globally banned. I had not harassed them during that time period, which is what it seems I am banned for.

Again, at the moment I am referring to the time before angel had you unbanned, the time which I unbanned you.

I had gone to gov's altar, I admit, yes, but not to PK them. They remained on peaceful because of everything, and I only know of them going back on b-mode recently.

The only conflict that I could think of having with them prior to me being banned again and having angel unban me is me getting their Monkey Sandals traded to me. I can understand why it looked like I had them "stolen," but I didn't, really. I just traded a guy that had sandals a RoW and Dark Flame for them.

Um, I distinctly recall being there in what appeared to be a war zone (still referring to after giving you the second chance), and several people telling me that you went there and PKed them.

I don't remember that, really. I tried to avoid conflicts with Dustari after I was unbanned, and I would go to Gov's rarely to see if it was clear to sit and wait for lords to come by.

I remember seeing you there BEFORE I was initially banned. That's the only time that I can think of it being a warzone.

I was there no less than twice; the first purposefully; the second unintentionally.

The first time, they had asked me to come help out since you and brad were PKing them. I said 'Sure' and went and watched.

The second time, i was delivering a Dustari wand (those things are rather nice-looking) to someone, and there was a rather large crowd around the govannon alter. I said "Erm...", then asked what was going on. They said one word: Torankusu. Well, they used a few more words (is trying to PK us), but that was the main point.

Anyway, I also distinctly recall both times people having left the kingdom - the first time since you were in forest; the second time i didn't understand why, since you were no longer in Forest at that time (Someone had removed you).

Wha...?

I was in forest prior to my being banned the first time. That's the only time any of them left the kingdom, and that's the only time it was a warzone at Gov's. I left Forest after I got back from being banned.

After you unbanned me when we had an agreement I informed Zoe that I would leave her/wren/dustari be as long as they did the same. I went to Gov's, and craigus did leave me alone, I didn't PK him or attack at him until Tec came up to me in the Trading house and Craigus casted icestorm, etc. Of course I tried to defend myself by trying to stop the one casting magic, but this did not happen at gov's altar. The only attacking that went on at Gov's altar was Tec attacking me after I was unbanned. (note, the PM log.)

After I was unbanned the only type of attacks that may have happened to Wren or Zoe is lightning (forked lightning) because I would cast it on lords, and Forked Lightning goes a loooong way. But any message of attacking them I would get on my screen said they were in peaceful. (it was not my itent to hit them with lightning.)

There was a second time - I distinctly recall looking at Forest, seeing you not in there, and wondering why Craigus and Tecumseh had left Dustari to "fight back," when you couldn't have hit them to begin with.

And, the agreement you made with me said you would stay away from them, and therefore that would not even give them a chance to PK you.

I did STAY AWAY from them. Any time conflict between us would arise is when they came into the same vicinity as me, and they would launch the attack first. I'm not stupid enough to pick fights with someone a higher level than I, especially if he is like level 40+

And I left forest during the middle of the warzone since I could not PK Dustari either. (before I was banned the first time)

Hey Tseng, stop going off topic in my thread, thanks.

And I upgraded Rahtnab when it ran out, and Stefan had no problem with it, it is no longer Brads and Brad never had the pass until Angel changed the password and she had no right to do that. So when you think of it, if Angel never changed the pass I would still have my account.

??
Angel didn't change the pass until I used it. Brad didn't WANT the pass changed.

This seems to be real sketchy and nobody seems to know for certain what happened when.

Order of Events from my memory/point of view:

It all started when I asked Zoe/Wren if they would trade Blood Ring, Wren told me she would for Dual RoWs. I got the dual rows, found out she gave it to zoe, asked her if she would trade it for Dual RoWs. She replied calling me selfish and other things which Kind of HURT seeing as I had helped wren level for hours (even though it may have been wrong). So, in turn, Brad casts forked lightning and Zoe dies, though it said I killed her (how is this possible, I was allied?, and I didn't even have lightning.) Brad and I are targetted by Dustari for killing their "princess." We think nothing of it other than it being a fun little mini-war, and we continue to fight back against tec, craigus, some other dudes. I was not Leuctious at the time so I think I was level 25 still. After a while of fighting I finally left Gov and let them be, but they tracked me down and persisted in killing me (after they left thier Kingdom to attack me). I then proceeded to set my nickname to "!! I WONDER HOW MANY PEOPLE WILL PK ME WHEN I SET MY NICKNAME TO ZOE'S A B*****" just to make dustari even madder and give them an actual purpose to attack me. Tseng then warned me and I changed it, yet Dustari and I continued fighting for hours. During that time I saw Tseng at the altar looking confused as 349324 dustari people would cast magic every time I'd run by the altar and they'd hurt each other (shobre, tasha, tec, craigus, some other guy...). After that I think it was about the time I started to talk to Tseng about how dustari was pitiful and it had to have members leave their kingdom to PK me, and Tseng remarked about how I was allied so they HAD to leave, so I left MY Kingdom (for good). Well it continued for a little while and Eventually I think I was banned or something, so I started to play on Torankusu_2002 and talked to Tseng about it all and told him it's not my intention to screw them over/piss them off/attack them (which it wasn't, and still isn't.) Eventually I agreed to leave them be (as i did to the best of my ability while remaining free to go to Gov's for the lord kills). I played for a day or so, the entire time Tec/Craigus still following me around attacking me wherever they saw me. Eventually Zoe saw it and PMed me asking me if I wanted them to quit, I said yes, and it resulted in the log you saw earlier. Tec and Craigus did not stop PKing us (brad and I) wherever they saw us, though we tried to avoid conflicts. Eventually I saw that someone had scammed Zoe's sandals, and then he offered to trade them to me, so we went to the tables, and I traded for them. I was warped to an event shortly after getting the sandals and during the event I was banned. Then I played on Banthar for a day or so, and DV started to harass Brad and I got a SS and so did Brad, so we showed it to Angel, and angel asked why I wasn't using my account, I told her it was banned, and for "Sexual harassment," though I had talked became neutral with both Wren and Zoe, and I was later unbanned by Tseng with the help of Angel. About three hours later or so Zoe and I were talking and she heard I needed a prepare weapon scroll and asked me to make an offer on it, I told her I had one diamond to spare, so she said she would give it to me for free (log). Shortly after that, without getting the prepare weapon scroll, I was banned globally. I have not had the chance to harass them since, seeing as I was on maybe two hours after I was unbanned globally (before I was banned again), in the meantime Wren had made a "notion" to be friends, which I didn't pick up at the time, but later found out and agreed to. Now, I have no intention of bothering them, It seems the only one making a big deal out of me harassing anybody is you, Tseng. I am only responding in my defense on the matter.

YES, I WILL ADMIT, I may have harassed them (via PMs asking for trades, etc, and attacks prior to my being banned the first time), but I DID NOT harass them after I was unbanned and the agreement took place. I'm not that stupid.

YES, I WILL ADMIT, I harassed Misty Di as well, and that got me my first warning on the case of harassment, but I left her alone afterwards and put her and Huang on my ignore.

YES, I WILL ADMIT, I have Zoe's Monkey sandals, however, I traded for them legitimately, and did not have anybody steal them.

I changed the pass a few days before I left because I knew this would happen, and someone changed the password....

If Wren and Zoe are both cool with you now and wouldn't mind if you were unbanned, have them both tell me that. Otherwise, I won't believe that they are cool with you.

[edit]
There's only one problem.
I don't have any way to contact them, and I really don't want to bug them with a third party.

Then I will ask them myself at the earliest convenience.

what exactly are you going to ask them?

"Have you agreed to be on neutral/friendship terms with Toran?"
or something of the sort?

Something like that, yes.

Note that I am asking that to verify the validity of your point, not for any other reason.

I just want my things back, this is either angels or lyndzeys fault, one of them changed the pass for Brad.

surely it was an accident.

About the Torankusu situation, he did not CC fraud (or at least not that we know of). I have decided to unban him from Kingdoms because he has been banned for a few days because of his harrassment. He is now under close eye by the admins and one more mistake will mean he will be banned for a while.

As for the Rahtnab account, I changed it for Brad after he lent it to Torankusu. While I was on vacation, I was talking to Brad on AIM and I told him he could not give his account password out to anyone. I don't know how Brad got the account password when Ex had changed it, but I assumed that Ex was gone considering he had not been on for weeks (thought it was too long of a vacation) and he was the owner. I had no idea you had upgraded it after he had originally bought it, I will have this sorted out as soon as Brad gets back from vacation...

I don't care about Rahtnab I just want my old things on zell12 now to ease the future confusion, also my stats from Rahtnab to zell12 (it was supposed to be like that but stefan screwed up) -_-

Then why is this still being discussed, they should both be globally banned...

How so? Angel's already talked to us about it, that's why she changed Rahtnab's pass.