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View Full Version : Stefan, lag from PMs


Kaimetsu
05-15-2001, 12:31 AM
I suggest that PMs should not be downloaded unless the player decides to read them. Recieving all those bytes from the server must really cause a fair bit of latency where it matters - in the game. If I'm sparring then I don't care if someone called "NINJAH4X0R2000" decides to tell everyone how much he hates "KILAGOKUU842". No, I just care about the fight, and some PMs are huge. On big servers like Classic, I'm sure this contributes quite a lot to the awful lag conditions we currently suffer from.

Sure, we can turn off mass messages but then we might miss an important one from a member of staff or a close friend. It would be far better if the text was only retrieved when the player double clicked the name in the list.

WhoopA
05-15-2001, 12:37 PM
Staff messages are always sent through - these are red bubbles.

Kaimetsu
05-15-2001, 07:15 PM
Well, okay, but tht's not the point. There's still considerable traffic coming in at a time when it probably shouldn't be. My choice: I can either lag in a spar, or I can miss all PMs for the duration of that spar. Those options aren't too good.

Kaimetsu
05-18-2001, 12:23 AM
*waves his hand in Stefan's direction*

Hey, I made a valid point here!

Psyker
05-18-2001, 08:20 AM
Originally posted by WhoopA
Staff messages are always sent through - these are red bubbles.
Some staff abuse those privelages. :(!

FxChiP
05-20-2001, 02:29 AM
Originally posted by Psyker

Some staff abuse those privelages. :(!

Some, he says.

Hehe :D

Kaimetsu
05-22-2001, 01:14 AM
*screws piece of paper up and throws it at Stefan's head*

I know that this post doesn't really need an answer from you, Stef, but if I don't know that you've read it then I have to keep bumping it up again. Could you let me know if you've seen this?

Kaimetsu
05-23-2001, 03:50 AM
*throws a lead weight at Stefan's head*

Next time it's a bomb!

aran_lesai
05-24-2001, 03:39 PM
There is waaay too much lag from PMs, and I've been killed a few times when i accidentally clicked on a pm, and was waiting for it to load. I also wish there was a way to turn the heads off on the mini-map, so you can still see it, but don't have the heads cluttering it up. A few weeks ago, they had a trivia quiz by PM, and b4 I could even read the questions, the answers were already up. I really could have used the cash prizes, as I don't PK, and I knew most of the answers. This is not too big of a deal, but it can be if you get killed while waiting for a PM to load. I strongly agree with Kaimetsu that PM's should be accessed through the playerlist. The toalls are fine, but PM's are big trouble, especially on my 28.8 modem. Also, I think the toalls should be cached in case you click through one. Once, i was waiting for some important information, and I accidentally double clicked, so the toall disappeared, and I had to feel stupid by asking again. This way, the toalls would be saved to a small text file, or even better, you could choose whether to save toalls or not in the options menu. NEway, sorry I got off the subject there, but yeah, good idea. There is another thread "GIM/buddy list" about making the chat system an external program, like AIM (which sux) or ICQ. That would end a lot of lag! Especially if the chat client was run on a separate server from the game server.
Stefan, please read this thread!!!!!!

P.S. Kaimetsu, how do you "screw up" a piece of paper?

Kaimetsu
05-24-2001, 11:48 PM
Originally posted by aran_lesai
There is waaay too much lag from PMs, and I've been killed a few times when i accidentally clicked on a pm, and was waiting for it to load.

The loading isn't the main problem and I wouldn't ask for that to be optimised because I haven't seen the source code and thus I can't suggest how to do it.

I also wish there was a way to turn the heads off on the mini-map, so you can still see it, but don't have the heads cluttering it up.

That's a good idea.

A few weeks ago, they had a trivia quiz by PM, and b4 I could even read the questions, the answers were already up. I really could have used the cash prizes, as I don't PK, and I knew most of the answers.

Yeah, that's kinda bad. But on the other hand, my system would even slow the process down slightly.

This is not too big of a deal, but it can be if you get killed while waiting for a PM to load. I strongly agree with Kaimetsu that PM's should be accessed through the playerlist.

I just need to make a little distinction here. PMs are loaded even before you click on them, and the lag can happen at any time whether you're reading the PM or not. Whenever somebody sends something, Graal downloads it, and that's not good.

The toalls are fine, but PM's are big trouble, especially on my 28.8 modem. Also, I think the toalls should be cached in case you click through one. Once, i was waiting for some important information, and I accidentally double clicked, so the toall disappeared, and I had to feel stupid by asking again. This way, the toalls would be saved to a small text file, or even better, you could choose whether to save toalls or not in the options menu.

Or just make a mini-history of the last, say, 3 messages.

NEway, sorry I got off the subject there, but yeah, good idea. There is another thread "GIM/buddy list" about making the chat system an external program, like AIM (which sux) or ICQ. That would end a lot of lag! Especially if the chat client was run on a separate server from the game server.

But instant messaging services still require the player to download large amounts of text without first telling the program that he/she wants to. I'll explain the system that I'm proposing just after I've finished my replyathon.

Stefan, please read this thread!!!!!!

I'll agree with you there. I've got my bomb ready and he has a total of five days before I throw it.

P.S. Kaimetsu, how do you "screw up" a piece of paper?

Hmm, I'll put this down to language differences. Take a piece of paper, then squash it along its plane. Continue to scrunch it in this way until it is a small ball of very roughly folded up paper. Congratulations! You've just screwed that paper up. It sounds silly, I suppose, if you're not used to the lingo, but that's a common phrase here.

And anyway, the system would work something like a message board. You go to the board and you know if people have posted because it sends you scraps of information such as the last poster and the time. This is what the PM system should do. It should alert the users that a PM has been sent and that should appear on their playerlist. But instead of downloading straight away it is kept on the server with a unique ID (much like in our history folders but stored separately instead of grouping by account names). When the person clicks the PM, it sends a request to the server (along with the message ID, which would come with the rest of the message stuff) and then the server would send that specific PM to us. There'd be slightly more lag in actually recieving the message but it'd stop huge amounts of text clogging our modems when we're trying to fight or whatever.

Kaimetsu
05-25-2001, 01:22 AM
Originally posted by Gspeed2000
I know this is sort of off topic but isn't the proper term crunching up a peice of paper or crumpling it? *shrugs* so many ways to say really odd things :)

It wouldn't be in a country where "crunching" and "crumpling" meant completely different things. There's no universal right and wrong; we just have to deal with what we know and hope that our right and wrong works wherever we are.

WhoopA
05-25-2001, 02:14 AM
I really don't care as long as I get the jist of the message.

As for mass PM's, I just turn them off. Most of them are pointless.

Kaimetsu
05-25-2001, 02:19 AM
Originally posted by WhoopA
I really don't care as long as I get the jist of the message.

As for mass PM's, I just turn them off. Most of them are pointless.

Emphasis on "most of". And that still doesn't beat single-person PMs.

If two people were sparring (let's say it's Game and Shady). Shady's men would want him to win and thus they'd want Gameo to lag as much as possible, so they could just send him strings of huge PMs to clog up his connection. This kind of "lag attack" is not a good thing and can make some crucial differences in some circumstances.

Kaimetsu
05-29-2001, 05:30 AM
Originally posted by Kaimetsu
I'll agree with you there. I've got my bomb ready and he has a total of five days before I throw it.

*looks at his watch*

Two days and counting...

Thak2
05-29-2001, 05:35 AM
Originally posted by Gspeed2000
I know this is sort of off topic but isn't the proper term crunching up a peice of paper or crumpling it? *shrugs* so many ways to say really odd things :)

You can screw anything up, just means disfiguring and making it un-proper or something...

aran_lesai
05-31-2001, 09:18 PM
J/K about "screwing up paper". Phrases can have very different meanings in different countries. BTW, what country are you in (just wondering)? The mini-history idea rocks! Maybe you should make the bomb a mail bomb and send it to Stefan. Then he would get the massage! (lol)

Cloud_X
05-31-2001, 09:20 PM
I like this idea.

Kaimetsu
05-31-2001, 11:47 PM
GodSpeed, that's exactly what I'm referring to.

And, for those who don't alrady know from my incessant whining, I'm living in England, the home of the English language. Therefore, anyone who dares threaten my lingual know-how is wrong before they even open their mouths.

Yes, I'm joking.

IceHawk
06-01-2001, 12:11 AM
Alt + 3 will turn off your mini-map, you will still see toalls and PMs.

Kaimetsu
06-01-2001, 04:57 AM
Originally posted by IceHawk
Alt + 3 will turn off your mini-map, you will still see toalls and PMs.

That's not the point. It won't stop lag.

Kaimetsu
06-01-2001, 10:41 PM
Originally posted by Kaimetsu


*looks at his watch*

Two days and counting...

That's it, he's had more than enough time now.

*drops the bomb down Stefan's chimney*

XilosTinsu
06-06-2001, 03:31 AM
Originally posted by aran_lesai
I think the toalls should be cached in case you click through one. This way, the toalls would be saved to a small text file, or even better, you could choose whether to save toalls or not in the options menu.
OR maybe you could extend the white chat box area and have the last 3 toalls stored under where you enter text.

Admins
06-06-2001, 04:33 AM
I am only reading threads that look interesting :-)
Changing the playerlist is an important thing,
it should be more optimized so that you don't see
all people on the list (not sure about this)

Only sending PMs when double-clicking wouldn't be
so good, then opening a PM would lag. I don't think
that sending the PMs is a big problem. Most
traffic is caused by receiving player positions from the
current level, and positions of players on the map.

Changing the thing so that you only see your
buddies on the playerlist or only displaying
buddies on the map would mean less traffic,
but it would take away a lot of Graal's feeling
of being able to always contact everyone.

Admins
06-06-2001, 04:34 AM
btw have caught the bomb and threw it back

Brandon_Bravo
06-06-2001, 05:00 AM
Originally posted by Stefan:

btw have catched the bomb and threw it back

Stefan, that would be caught, not catched.

Admins
06-06-2001, 05:13 AM
hehe i was concentrating on the 'threw' thing
(hope that at least that was right :-)

Brandon_Bravo
06-06-2001, 05:15 AM
Originally posted by Stefan:
hehe i was concentrizing on the 'threw' thing

I believe you were concentrating, not concentrizing.

LOL, Ok, I'll stop picking on you now Stefan.

Munkey
06-06-2001, 08:09 AM
Originally posted by Stefan
btw have caught the bomb and threw it back

lmao

Kaimetsu
06-06-2001, 07:19 PM
Originally posted by Stefan
I am only reading threads that look interesting :-)


Alright, that's it.

*runs away to find a bigger bomb, then comes back*

I can't believe that PMs don't contribute to lag (although I'm in agreement on the issue of the playerlists and maps etc). Everytime anybody sends a mass message, we must be downloading something like 100 bytes at a time. I mean, it may not necessarily produce much of a visible effect, but think of the traffic! Think of the traffic! To a scripter who spends hours thinking of ways to cut down transfer volumes (like on my Drakkara) it's a constant source of pain, worry and doubt.

Now, getting back to what's important...

*affixes the bomb to Stefan's head with duct tape*

Tyhm
06-07-2001, 03:37 AM
I once made a NPC that caught and threw back bombs. It wasn't really intentional, it just detected when it was near a bomb, picked it up and threw it at you. bombs[index].x and y apply to flying bombs too. I think it's still up in Old Graal, in the cheap hotel room...like anyone cares. ^^;