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Bayne_graal
06-10-2012, 01:26 AM
Does anyone else dislike unholy nation cause we can't play events or spar i think we should make the spar disconnect you if you go in observer an make some events playable for trials.

Imperialistic
06-10-2012, 01:31 AM
I apologize on Graal Administration's behalf,

They implemented the disgusting trial restrictions several years ago. Unfortunately, the only way for you to enjoy(lol) the game would be paying a ridiculous amount of money for a member subscription.

ffcmike
06-10-2012, 01:32 AM
That's not really a reason to dislike UN, the problem comes from the top.

Bayne_graal
06-10-2012, 01:35 AM
I don't mind being trial on classic i got thor to great me with a kind welcome.

Bayne_graal
06-10-2012, 07:44 AM
I had a change of heart let unholy nation die :D

nightslayer317
06-10-2012, 12:57 PM
I don't mind being trial on classic i got thor to great me with a kind welcome.

Classic is a lot of fun, it always has been. Especially with these new quests that Thor has been releasing. You also find other ways to be entertained.

Unholy Nation also used to be a lot of fun. People used to find ways to be entertained on there, but most of the classic UN players have moved on. The ones that are left seem to be the ones that can't leave. Most have turned into Trolls.

skillmaster19
06-13-2012, 12:40 AM
They added more restrictions to trials months ago in hopes to get observer mode released and stefan still refused. They still haven't removed those restrictions and it made the majority of the trial population quit.

Mark Sir Link
06-13-2012, 03:03 AM
They added more restrictions to trials months ago in hopes to get observer mode released and stefan still refused. They still haven't removed those restrictions and it made the majority of the trial population quit.

this is a lot of conjecture that's probably not accurate

the main restrictions put into place were fairly generous limits on how much currency could be carried, but limitations have for the most part gone down over the past year or so, since trials used to be barred from events at all times and now that's no longer the case.

it's a delicate situation that basically goes on way only since I can't force the removal of observer mode, nor do I have any idea exactly what it is they're looking for.

Stowen
06-13-2012, 05:28 AM
paying a ridiculous amount of money for a member subscription.

I think Graal should be F2P again, as do a majority of the players. But $5 a month isn't really all that bad. Yeah, on the store section of the GraalOnline website there are more expensive "bundles" for gelats. If you use a credit card, or other source of payment, via SuperRewards, you can purchase 400 gelats for 5 USD. It only takes 300 gelats for 1 month of Gold. I wouldn't suggest doing many of the offers, though. Most of them are viruses! Just a warning.

skillmaster19
06-13-2012, 05:40 AM
this is a lot of conjecture that's probably not accurate

the main restrictions put into place were fairly generous limits on how much currency could be carried, but limitations have for the most part gone down over the past year or so, since trials used to be barred from events at all times and now that's no longer the case.

it's a delicate situation that basically goes on way only since I can't force the removal of observer mode, nor do I have any idea exactly what it is they're looking for.
Limiting currency was a terrible way to attempt replacing observer mode. Some items couldn't even be received because of their prices vs gralat/ec cap.

Try and mimic the success the iPhone servers have by adding "gralat packs" or "ep packs" for gelats. UN is similar to iClassic(just better), so I don't see why stefan wont like a model similar to iClassics which was very successful.

nightslayer317
06-13-2012, 03:16 PM
Limiting currency was a terrible way to attempt replacing observer mode. Some items couldn't even be received because of their prices vs gralat/ec cap.

Try and mimic the success the iPhone servers have by adding "gralat packs" or "ep packs" for gelats. UN is similar to iClassic(just better), so I don't see why stefan wont like a model similar to iClassics which was very successful.

I think Stefan is also worried about exposing the players from iClassic to the players of UN. They are not the greatest crowd to game with. Take Mystic for example, a player that has a sole reason only to troll and dig into other player's personal lives. Most of us oldbies just laugh at how pathetic he is but some of the newer players might be more sensitive to a player stepping outside the boundaries of an online game and stepping into a personal life.

I'm not sure what else Stefan is expecting regarding the gameplay, limitations and whatever else is required for observer mode (which could be fixed), but I can imagine that he is also hesitant regarding the trolling playerbase (which can't really be fixed). We could enforce stricter GP precautions to protect the players better, but then the other players would just complain that the administration is even more corrupt. So we're kind of stuck in a shitty loop de loop ;)

xXziroXx
06-13-2012, 07:50 PM
I think Stefan's main concern with UN is how easy it is for corrupt staff etc. to add weapons to players. Edit attributes, add another weapon, ta-daa! Doesn't give the best of confidence for implementing a gelat shop and removing observer mode.

cbk1994
06-13-2012, 08:43 PM
I think Stefan's main concern with UN is how easy it is for corrupt staff etc. to add weapons to players. Edit attributes, add another weapon, ta-daa! Doesn't give the best of confidence for implementing a gelat shop and removing observer mode.

This is kind of a fact of Graal. It's not much harder on Era for a scripter to spawn something than it is on UN. If his main concern is corruption in the staff team, then volunteer staff members coming from the pool of players isn't the way to go.

xXziroXx
06-13-2012, 09:40 PM
This is kind of a fact of Graal. It's not much harder on Era for a scripter to spawn something than it is on UN.

Not my idea of secure item systems. :)

Mark Sir Link
06-13-2012, 10:05 PM
Limiting currency was a terrible way to attempt replacing observer mode. Some items couldn't even be received because of their prices vs gralat/ec cap.

Try and mimic the success the iPhone servers have by adding "gralat packs" or "ep packs" for gelats. UN is similar to iClassic(just better), so I don't see why stefan wont like a model similar to iClassics which was very successful.

The limits were based around the most expensive items for each currency that were sold directly by vendors so the only thing it prohibited was player trading, which was the entire point since there needed to be some incentive to upgrade.

I think Stefan's main concern with UN is how easy it is for corrupt staff etc. to add weapons to players. Edit attributes, add another weapon, ta-daa! Doesn't give the best of confidence for implementing a gelat shop and removing observer mode.

In terms of item security I think we're sort of beating a dead horse because whatever I can do to prevent staff members from getting things they shouldn't can easily be undone by said staff members.

Without any real engine support which I've asked for numerous times in other threads, the best I can make are scripted workarounds that anyone else with NC can ignore. I'd be frustrated if the problem is staff being untrustworthy since right now they're trusted to the extent of somehow bringing revenue in, and any requests that are made to throttle abusive behavior basically need an engine implementation that is not forthcoming

Mark Sir Link
06-13-2012, 10:06 PM
and a theoretical (AKA I actually do this) is I join players to classes that overwrite default functions, pass the callstack to a DB NPC that removes the player from that class and does intended behavior and re-joins them.

This scheme is a house of cards just waiting to collapse

Other solutions are a sort of nightmare scenario like monitoring the accounts folder for file modification times (there are hundreds of thousands of account files on UN) and require far too many resources for far too little benefit

cbk1994
06-13-2012, 11:32 PM
Not my idea of secure item systems. :)

I don't think this is a problem with a technical solution. If your scripters are halfway competent, they'll figure out a way to get around whatever roadblocks you've added. I'd rather spend time developing game content than trying to "secure" an item system. The real solution is managing and monitoring your staff team.

nightslayer317
06-14-2012, 01:03 AM
I don't think this is a problem with a technical solution. If your scripters are halfway competent, they'll figure out a way to get around whatever roadblocks you've added. I'd rather spend time developing game content than trying to "secure" an item system. The real solution is managing and monitoring your staff team.

So since that issue is universal, we can move on from that one and shift back towards the playerbase which is most likely what Stefan is trying not to expose the new community too. I don't blame him.

Starfire2001
06-14-2012, 01:20 AM
So since that issue is universal, we can move on from that one and shift back towards the playerbase which is most likely what Stefan is trying not to expose the new community too. I don't blame him.

To be honest I don't really think its any worse than iphone. And a ton of people form UN have played iphone by now, they've already been exposed.

nightslayer317
06-14-2012, 01:26 AM
To be honest I don't really think its any worse than iphone. And a ton of people form UN have played iphone by now, they've already been exposed.

You are correct, however 1 occasional UN troll (or 2) would not really effect the iphone noob that much. After all they are iphone classic (which i believe means they are classic in those parts) so they are tough **** so they can deal with it. Throw a bunch of ugly troll faced UN kids at them (most of them are, yes I know sad but true) on their UN home server and the iphoners might just **** themselves off of Graal.

Fulg0reSama
06-14-2012, 01:10 PM
To be honest I don't really think its any worse than iphone. And a ton of people form UN have played iphone by now, they've already been exposed.

You are correct, however 1 occasional UN troll (or 2) would not really effect the iphone noob that much. After all they are iphone classic (which i believe means they are classic in those parts) so they are tough **** so they can deal with it. Throw a bunch of ugly troll faced UN kids at them (most of them are, yes I know sad but true) on their UN home server and the iphoners might just **** themselves off of Graal.

Haha, Welcome to any game with more then one generation of community evolution.

Yes, they feel they've established ground in the game's community in one root or another, so they feel they've become accustomed to the game as a whole in an adaptive sense.

MysticX2X
06-14-2012, 08:35 PM
Take Mystic for example, a player that has a sole reason only to troll and dig into other player's personal lives. Most of us oldbies just laugh at how pathetic he is but some of the newer players might be more sensitive to a player stepping outside the boundaries of an online game and stepping into a personal life.


Considering this guy is regarded as the worst GP on UN (and I have heard many stories), this is pretty funny.

But to answer your speculation of why Stefan won't disable observer mode, it's becausethere is really no proper way to place a gelat shop on Unholy Nation. At least half of the scripts are in GS1 and outdated (to my knowledge). Otherwise, if you insist on posting false facts about players being the reason (apparently you have a crush on me), then go ahead.

nightslayer317
06-14-2012, 10:23 PM
Haha, Welcome to any game with more then one generation of community evolution.

Yes, they feel they've established ground in the game's community in one root or another, so they feel they've become accustomed to the game as a whole in an adaptive sense.

It would be interesting to see how they would adapt to UN. Things on UN are a bit different than the sanctuary that is iClassic.

Considering this guy is regarded as the worst GP on UN (and I have heard many stories), this is pretty funny.

But to answer your speculation of why Stefan won't disable observer mode, it's becausethere is really no proper way to place a gelat shop on Unholy Nation. At least half of the scripts are in GS1 and outdated (to my knowledge). Otherwise, if you insist on posting false facts about players being the reason (apparently you have a crush on me), then go ahead.

:cry: would you like some tissues?