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Mark Sir Link
12-23-2010, 10:49 AM
Will Unholy Nation sustain itself with just hiring ETs/GPs/FAQs? As best I can tell, nothing is even slated for release beyond some holiday content that will last virtually the same amount of time as a quest, but be available only for a limited amount of time.

I know firsthand that the current manager is a very big fan of micro-managing on this server, so I guess the real question is what has come out of managing Unholy Nation with this approach? I know a manager traditionally tries to bring their vision to a server, but it seems like either the current manager is unwilling to take the steps to implement his vision or is simply content with everything that has been released to this point and feels updates are no longer needed.

I know, I know, the typical excuse will usually come up here that the manager alone cannot develop all the content on a server. This argument might be sensible if no one were willing to help Unholy Nation, but I know for a fact that developers are willing to work on Unholy Nation still (namely myself) and obviously are incapable of hiring themselves. Having an extremely inflexible manager has already killed the server in the short term and I'm sure will do nothing to help in the long run, not like the long run even matters.

I don't understand how any player could possibly take any current development (LAT, NAT, etc) staff member on Unholy Nation seriously, considering the complete lack of content released in the past 3 months and no indication of anything to come. I know I'd certainly be wary of those who keep telling me great things are coming when they never come, but I can't make everyone see things the way I do.

It seems the server is being held back entirely by one person's ego, and it's really a shame.

I wish the PWA would intervene or the current manager would step down on their own or at least be willing to compromise on somethings, but it seems highly unlikely either will happen. Since this is the case, I'd love for the management of Unholy Nation to just admit that the Events Team is offering the only compelling game play on Unholy Nation and stop pretending Development is getting things done.

12171217
12-23-2010, 01:26 PM
Ugh, do people still care about UN?

nightslayer317
12-23-2010, 03:04 PM
We got some nice things in the works, both for holidays and after the holidays. Keep your eyes open, maybe you'll see something really nice soon ;)

RegretZ
12-23-2010, 06:44 PM
Ugh, do people still care about UN?

Surprisingly, they still have a generally high player-count.

fowlplay4
12-23-2010, 11:09 PM
Surprisingly, they still have a generally high player-count.

No they don't, most of the player-count is just staff and very little new players with zero signs of potential growth.

RegretZ
12-23-2010, 11:18 PM
No they don't, most of the player-count is just staff and very little new players with zero signs of potential growth.

Well, staff and US. OH WAIT, THERE'S NO DIFFERENCE ;) silly me
Just kidding.

MysticX2X
12-23-2010, 11:19 PM
No they don't, most of the player-count is just staff and very little new players with zero signs of potential growth.

Staff are players too...

ffcmike
12-23-2010, 11:31 PM
Staff are players too...

Key phrase: zero signs of potential growth.

MysticX2X
12-23-2010, 11:51 PM
Key phrase: zero signs of potential growth.

That wasn't the point I was addressing. It was his assertion that the excuse for a high playercount is staff, even though they are players themselves and make up less than a third of the playercount.

nullify
12-24-2010, 01:27 AM
maybe

Keyword.

Unkownsoldier
12-24-2010, 04:58 AM
If you don't like it, then stop playing it. I can't see why people have the nerve to complain about such things. If the game doesn't meet your standards then leave. Yet, if you decide to stay suck it up and let it take its natural course. Opening a thread that is all about complaints with no practical solutions isn't very productive and it actually sends out a negative message attracting even less players. If you really feel like it isn't going anywhere, learn how to make GOOD levels, learn how to script GOOD items/levels, learn to design GOOD graphics then make something on the server that you deem worthwhile. Then and only then can you talk. ;)

kia345
12-24-2010, 05:04 AM
If you really feel like it isn't going anywhere, learn how to make GOOD levels, learn how to script GOOD items/levels, learn to design GOOD graphics then make something on the server that you deem worthwhile. Then and only then can you talk. ;)

wow this is like the worst advice ever

"if you think something someone else has done is bad, fix it yourself!"


As customers, players, and volunteers, we have a right to complain. Not "to tell people what the problem is and then brainstorm how we can better it!", but straight up complain.

RegretZ
12-24-2010, 05:10 AM
wow this is like the worst advise ever

"if you think something someone else has done is bad, fix it yourself!"


As customers, players, and volunteers, we have a right to complain. Not "to tell people what the problem is and then brainstorm how we can better it!", but straight up complain.

I WILL FIGHT FOR MY RIGHT TO COMPLAIN!!! !pissed!

DustyPorViva
12-24-2010, 05:11 AM
The whole "if you think it sucks do it better" and "if you don't like it leave" is the kind of mentality that is killing Graal. And I don't mean from a player to player perspective. I mean it's the sort of thing players are told by the administration to answer the shortcomings of Graal. Let's sit back and look how well that has worked out.

RegretZ
12-24-2010, 05:24 AM
The whole "if you think it sucks do it better" and "if you don't like it leave" is the kind of mentality that is killing Graal. And I don't mean from a player to player perspective. I mean it's the sort of thing players are told by the administration to answer the shortcomings of Graal. Let's sit back and look how well that has worked out.

What's this, "Administration" people keep talking about? Are they supposed to talk to us or something?
;) Kidding.

Mark Sir Link
12-24-2010, 06:15 AM
If you don't like it, then stop playing it. I can't see why people have the nerve to complain about such things. If the game doesn't meet your standards then leave. Yet, if you decide to stay suck it up and let it take its natural course. Opening a thread that is all about complaints with no practical solutions isn't very productive and it actually sends out a negative message attracting even less players. If you really feel like it isn't going anywhere, learn how to make GOOD levels, learn how to script GOOD items/levels, learn to design GOOD graphics then make something on the server that you deem worthwhile. Then and only then can you talk. ;)

I know for a fact that developers are willing to work on Unholy Nation still (namely myself)

Maybe read?

nightslayer317
12-24-2010, 04:35 PM
Maybe read?

Kevin, Santa's Grotto is now open in Dispora. Did you buy me a present?

Unkownsoldier
12-24-2010, 05:41 PM
wow this is like the worst advice ever

"if you think something someone else has done is bad, fix it yourself!"


As customers, players, and volunteers, we have a right to complain. Not "to tell people what the problem is and then brainstorm how we can better it!", but straight up complain.

We don't have the right to do so. As customers we should have researched what kind of a game it would be a before we bought it, the game never advertised that there was going to be updates so I don't know why people think there should be. You could assume there would be, but thats just because of prior knowledge of other games and its not good to assume. You can always come up with ideas on how to improve the game but thats up to the "administration" to follow or not-follow your suggestions. I don't see how you can complain when you should have known the game was going to be like this.

The whole "if you think it sucks do it better" and "if you don't like it leave" is the kind of mentality that is killing Graal. And I don't mean from a player to player perspective. I mean it's the sort of thing players are told by the administration to answer the shortcomings of Graal. Let's sit back and look how well that has worked out.

A game is suppose to have one function. That one function is to bring entertainment. Inside entertainment there are social, fun, and other aspects. Graal is just as much of a social game as it is a player-killing game etc. That is the basis of the game, no matter what content you insert that basis wouldn't really change unless you alter an aspect of the game completely. So take it or leave it is appropriate because the game isn't going to change, just the players and the content around you. No one stays for the content that just attracts them. If you could not speak/player-kill the game wouldn't exist. So if it sucks you should develop a new aspect into the game like administration tried to do with "skills games". It was a totally new environment that game has never explored.

Maybe read?

Then your thread should have stated "I am going to help develop this server due to lack of content in my opinion, and I know there is others who will do the same along side of me" not the total ranting of how bad the server has gotten.

kia345
12-24-2010, 05:58 PM
We don't have the right to do so. As customers we should have researched what kind of a game it would be a before we bought it, the game never advertised that there was going to be updates so I don't know why people think there should be. You could assume there would be, but thats just because of prior knowledge of other games and its not good to assume. You can always come up with ideas on how to improve the game but thats up to the "administration" to follow or not-follow your suggestions. I don't see how you can complain when you should have known the game was going to be like this.

Man, it's like you disappeared to learn how to type, but came back just as dumb as you were before. This is the most backwards logic ever.

"you can't say the game is bad because you should've known it was bad preemptively, leave if you don't like it??"

No. And we're not talking about Graal as a whole here (or you'd be even more stupid in this scenario), just UN. This is a server run by players. You know, like every server. And because it's managed by our peers, we have even more reason to complain. Because we may be able to do it better. We may be able to offer better development, better ideas, better directions for it go in. Instead, we get "okay have some hats and GPs". UN is dropping the ball, and it's up to other people to point that out, or else the server will continue to decline.

If people play UN and don't like the updates, they can complain. They invested time into the server. The server only exists because people log on; if it didn't have any players, it would eventually leave. It's not like the player means nothing to the server - the players are the lifeblood of it. Every server's management should be bending over backwards to meet the players' demands. This isn't a "well UN's not doing it like that" kind of thing. This is the sort of logic that should apply to every place, company, group: meet the demands of the people you work for. Because in the end, they work for Graal, and because they're glorified players, they work for the rest of the players.

Players aren't doing it wrong by complaining, the server is doing it wrong by giving them a reason to.

And you're doing it wrong by pretending you have any idea what's going on.

And your reply to Mark Sir Link is laced with hypocrisy, as you imply it's all of Graal suffering from these things, yet here you are.

Unkownsoldier
12-24-2010, 06:56 PM
Man, it's like you disappeared to learn how to type, but came back just as dumb as you were before. This is the most backwards logic ever.

"you can't say the game is bad because you should've known it was bad preemptively, leave if you don't like it??"

No. And we're not talking about Graal as a whole here (or you'd be even more stupid in this scenario), just UN. This is a server run by players. You know, like every server. And because it's managed by our peers, we have even more reason to complain. Because we may be able to do it better. We may be able to offer better development, better ideas, better directions for it go in. Instead, we get "okay have some hats and GPs". UN is dropping the ball, and it's up to other people to point that out, or else the server will continue to decline.

If people play UN and don't like the updates, they can complain. They invested time into the server. The server only exists because people log on; if it didn't have any players, it would eventually leave. It's not like the player means nothing to the server - the players are the lifeblood of it. Every server's management should be bending over backwards to meet the players' demands. This isn't a "well UN's not doing it like that" kind of thing. This is the sort of logic that should apply to every place, company, group: meet the demands of the people you work for. Because in the end, they work for Graal, and because they're glorified players, they work for the rest of the players.

Players aren't doing it wrong by complaining, the server is doing it wrong by giving them a reason to.

And you're doing it wrong by pretending you have any idea what's going on.

And your reply to Mark Sir Link is laced with hypocrisy, as you imply it's all of Graal suffering from these things, yet here you are.

I might have said "you can't complain" before, which is my bad. What I meant was if you complain it wont change anything really. This has to be the 100th thread that has complaints riddled all throughout it, yet if you have noticed nothing has changed in years. Players have complained for years and suggestions have gone un-used.

I am here because I like to play events and spar. I couldn't care less if everything else about the game was gone. That's why I'M here.

Crono
12-24-2010, 07:11 PM
14 inches

Fulg0reSama
12-24-2010, 07:35 PM
14 inches

I had a feeling crono would be the first to try this joke.

MysticX2X
12-24-2010, 07:53 PM
I had a feeling crono would be the first to try this joke.

why

maximus_asinus
12-24-2010, 08:25 PM
I had a feeling crono would be the first to try this joke.I was going to reply with that too but Kevin made a marathon post so I didn't think it would have been that funny.

fowlplay4
12-24-2010, 09:16 PM
14 inches

You should go spend some time with Darlene and maybe the forum moderation will improve as a result.

WaDaFack
12-25-2010, 12:13 AM
Key phrase: zero signs of potential growth.
Does any server? :) It's not UN, it's Graal itself! Get that through your head!

Fulg0reSama
12-25-2010, 12:29 AM
You should go spend some time with Darlene and maybe the forum moderation will improve as a result.

Okay, This is the best post ever. But man we can't sacrifice our own to that beast, It's suicide!

@Mystic, It was just a feeling... Crono seems good at making those comments first or third.
@Kevin, Ah yeah, gotta hate it when you're possibly second in line.

RegretZ
12-25-2010, 12:32 AM
Okay, This is the best post ever. But man we can't sacrifice our own to that beast, It's suicide!

I know right? I literally laughed out loud at this. I can seriously appreciate his humor now XD

Rufus
12-25-2010, 01:21 AM
We got some nice things in the works, both for holidays and after the holidays. Keep your eyes open, maybe you'll see something really nice soon ;)

Maybe you should tell them what is in the works.

MattKan
12-29-2010, 07:19 PM
Maybe you should tell them what is in the works.

waiting....

nightslayer317
12-30-2010, 02:55 PM
Maybe you should tell them what is in the works.

and spoil the big surprise?!??!! NO WAY! :noob:

LordSquirt
12-30-2010, 04:43 PM
so is this a new years surprise since christmas is over

nightslayer317
12-30-2010, 09:26 PM
Life is like a box of chocolates.

DustyPorViva
12-30-2010, 09:28 PM
Life is like a box of chocolates.
You eat your own and then realize they're all full of ****, so you start stealing everyone elses and eating it.

nightslayer317
12-30-2010, 10:49 PM
You eat your own and then realize they're all full of ****, so you start stealing everyone elses and eating it.

I hate the coconut ones.

jorollychu
12-31-2010, 12:06 AM
lmao unknownshoulder kevin has developed some stuff you see every time you play UN. keep being an ignoramus neanderthal, kid.

Chakrah
01-07-2011, 11:30 PM
i hate UN